Chaos Golem

[Mithrandir]

Certified Gold Unit (http://www.tacticsarena.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16946)

Normally I like to talk about tactics for a while after explaining the basic info but considering how lengthy this basic info is, I’ll spare you.

This is probably the most complicated unit I’ve ever created (otherwise I’d talk about strategy a bit instead of leaving it to your imagination). For those of you that read it, or read enough of it to understand how the unit works, thank you, you are truly persevering. As a matter of fact, I’m pretty sure this is the first unit EVER in this forum to require two posts (22woger22 posted one earlier this week, making that two in the forum, but mine was written AND completed first :p ). For those of you that lack the patience, I can’t really blame you but please don’t criticize the unit without first mentioning that you didn’t really read it. And I would ask you to read the whole thing eventually, it isn’t a huge deal if you don’t do it all in one session. I sure didn’t make it all in one session.

As a matter of fact, I almost scrapped it in frustration just because of all the complication and difficulties. This is without a doubt the most difficult unit I’ve ever made, meaning it required more effort and careful thought and lots of false starts to make the concept I wanted work. But I am extremely pleased with the result.

Chaos Golem

HP: 60
Armor: 0
Power: 0
Blocking: 0
Movement: 5 (teleportation)
Recovery: 3
Attack Pattern: It affects all units either one or two spaces away from itself (same as enchantress).

Here’s where it gets difficult. A unit attacked by the Chaos Golem will move either one or two squares and attack a space (which space it attacks is decided by where the Chaos Golem is in relation to its victim, see the coded illustration). After the unit moves and attacks, it moves back to where it was, faced the same direction. The only harm the “used” unit takes is 1 recovery which is added to its wait time (just a one time extra, not a permanent effect). Enemy and friendly units attacked by the Chaos Golem behave exactly the same way. Here is a thorough explanation of how a knight behaves when it is attacked by the Chaos Golem, I hope it helps.

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Knight

O = Empty space
C = Chaos Golem
K = Knight
k = Space the knight moves to (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
X = Location of Cleric, which in every circumstance gets attacked (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
S = Shrub

Example 1:
OOOOOOO
OOOXOOO
OOOkOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 2:
OOOXOOO
OOOkOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 3:
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOXOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 4:
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOXOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 5:
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOkXOO
OOOKkOO
OOCOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 6:
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOXkOOO
OOkKOOO
OOOOCOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 7:
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOSOOO
OOOKSOO
OOCOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 8:
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOSOOO
OOSKOOO
OOOOCOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO

Example 9: Example 9B:
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOXOO OOOOOOO
OOOOkOO OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO OOOKOOO
OOCOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO

The X in Example 9 will be attacked if the square the knight was on right
before stepping on his current square was highlighted in Example 9B.

Example 10: Example 10B:
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOkXO OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO OOOKOOO
OOCOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO

The X in Example 10 will be attacked if the square the knight was on right
before stepping on his current square was highlighted in Example 10B.

Example 11: Example 11B:
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOXOOOO OOOOOOO
OOkOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO OOOKOOO
OOOOCOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO

The X in Example 11 will be attacked if the square the knight was on right
before stepping on his current square was highlighted in Example 11B.

Example 12: Example 12B:
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OXkOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO OOOKOOO
OOOOCOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO OOOOOOO

The X in Example 12 will be attacked if the square the knight was on right
before stepping on his current square was highlighted in Example 12B.

(continued in next post)

[Mithrandir]

Now naturally different units that are attacked will behave differently. The knight is the most simple so I used it as an example to illustrate the principles. Next are several sets of codes (much much shorter than the last one!) about how each unit behaves with its unique attack pattern. I don’t need to explain every detail of each unit, just apply the principles of the units to the knight illustrations. When there are multiple ways a space can be attacked, the unit will automatically attack it from the side if it can. Otherwise, it does what it can and of course if it can’t do anything, nothing is attacked, the unit just gains +1 recovery. In a situation where attacking from the side isn’t the issue, direction will be chosen based on the illustrations in Examples 9B through 12B.
When the Chaos Golem attacks an Assassin

O = Empty space
C = Chaos Golem
K = Assassin
k = Space the assassin moves to (under the influence of the Chaos Golem)
Q = Location of Cleric, which in every circumstance gets attacked (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
X = Empty spaces that are also attacked.

OOOQOOO
OOXkXOO
OOOXOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Beast Rider

O = Empty space
C = Chaos Golem
K = Beast Rider
k = Space the beast rider moves to (under the influence of the Chaos Golem)
Q = Location of Cleric, which in every circumstance gets attacked (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
X = Empty spaces that are also attacked.

OOOXOOO
OOOQOOO
OOOkOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Mud Golem

The Mud Golem does not use its muddy strike, it attack in exactly the
same way as the knight.

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Pyromancer, Dragonspeaker Mage or Furgon

O = Empty space
C = Chaos Golem
K = Pyro, DSM or Furgon
k = Space the pyro or DSM moves to (under the influence of the Chaos Golem)
Q = Location of Cleric, which in every circumstance gets attacked (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
X = Empty spaces that are also attacked.

OOOXOOO
OOXQXOO
OOOXOOO
OOOkOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

OOOXOOO
OOXQXOO
OOOkOOO The k is also attacked by the pyro blast.
OOOKOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Dark Magic Witch

O = Empty space
C = Chaos Golem
K = Witch
k = Space the witch moves to (under the influence of the Chaos Golem)
Q = Location of Cleric, which in every circumstance gets attacked (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
X = Empty spaces that are also attacked.

OOOQOOO
OOOXOOO
OOOXOOO
OOOXOOO
OOOkOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Cleric, Golem Ambusher,
Barrier Ward or Lightning Ward

The Cleric, Golem Ambusher and both wards receive a +1 recovery
but are not affected in any other way.

When the Chaos Golem attacks an Enchantress, Frost Golem or Stone Golem

The Enchantress, Frost Golem and Stone Golem receive a +1 recovery
but are not affected in any other way UNLESS they are in focus in
which case the focus is broken.

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Poison Wisp

First, if the Poison Wisp is already in focus, focus is broken.

O = Empty space
C = Chaos Golem
K = Poison Wisp
k = Space the poison wisp moves to (under the influence of the Chaos Golem)
Q = Location of Cleric, which in every circumstance gets attacked (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
X = Empty spaces that are also attacked.

OOOQOOO
OOOXOOO
OXXkXXO
OOOXOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

The attacked spaces take 8 damage, not reducible by armor,
but they do not take ongoing poison damage.

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Scout

O = Empty space
C = Chaos Golem
K = Scout
k = Space the scout moves to (under the influence of the Chaos Golem)
Q = Location of Cleric, which in every circumstance gets attacked (under
the influence of the Chaos Golem)
X = Empty spaces that are also attacked.

OOOQOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOkOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

OOOSOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOSOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOkOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOKOOO
OOOOOOO
OOOCOOO
OOOOOOO

In this case, the bolded Shrub is targeted but the unbolded Shrub is the one
that takes the hit because while the Scout targets the space as far away
as possible, LOS still applies.

When the Chaos Golem attacks a Dragon Tyrant

The Dragon Tyrant is affected the same way as the scout,
only with its range of 3 instead of 6.


Keep in mind that the Chaos Golem can affect more than one unit in one hit, all of which attack accordingly, one by one. Remember, it doesn’t matter which affected unit attacks first because after the unit moves and then attacks, it moves back to its original place.

The potential ways for this unit to be used are practically infinite. It would without question be a very challenging unit to use but if you could use it effectively, you could attack two or three of your opponent’s units in one shot.

There’s a lot of stuff here, lots of potential situations I didn’t cover. I hope the principles I’ve illustrated can answer some questions but inevitably, there are going to be things I’m leaving out. I’d be happy to try to help you understand this unit better if you have any questions.

[22woger22]

YAY!!! Another 2 post unit!

RESERVED: I just want to read it all first :).

First EDIT: As a matter of fact, I’m pretty sure this is the first unit EVER in this forum to require two posts
I'm pretty sure you know about it, but I made a 2-post unit yesterday. You probably typed this up on Microsoft Word or something and copy-pasted right?

[Mithrandir]

Yep, it's been ready for about a week. Check out the edited version. :p

[Moose]

It's not an original concept for a new style of golem, but it is well explained, well done :).

[Mithrandir]

Wow, you read fast. Could you link to the other one?

[22woger22]

Yes, it is very complicated, but before I give my review, I want to ask some questions:

1. Does the unit attacked by the chaos golem, automatically move and attack during the chaos golem's turn, or does it move/attack on different turns?

2. Does the unit attacked by the CG (i'm calling it that for short) always move away from the CG and attacks away from the CG, or can it move anywhere?

3. What happens if the CG attacks a shrub?

4. What happens if a unit that is attacked by the CG from 2 squares away, is surrounded by other units/shrub? Can it move through them, or does it have to attack one of them, or does it not do anything at all?

5. Because it is not a focus attack, does the CG's attack affect barriered units?

I'll ask more questions, when i'm not feeling so tired :). And I also give you the rights of making the first 2 post long unit :).

[Mithrandir]

1. Does the unit attacked by the chaos golem, automatically move and attack during the chaos golem's turn, or does it move/attack on different turns?
It’s a Chaos Golem attack so if it’s your Chaos Golem, the affected units do their attack on your turn.
2. Does the unit attacked by the CG (i'm calling it that for short) always move away from the CG and attacks away from the CG, or can it move anywhere?
You can’t select which direction the unit moves. It always moves away from the CG. MUCH much more tactical that way.
3. What happens if the CG attacks a shrub?
Nothing. Shrubs only come into play if they stop an affected unit from being able to move to where it would otherwise move.
4. What happens if a unit that is attacked by the CG from 2 squares away, is surrounded by other units/shrub? Can it move through them, or does it have to attack one of them, or does it not do anything at all?
It doesn’t move through them, it will attack one of them. See example 4 in the first post.
5. Because it is not a focus attack, does the CG's attack affect barriered units?
Aha, you found something I hadn’t considered. Logically speaking the barriered unit moves so it ought to break the barrier focus but considering it is NOT a focus attack, as you say, a barriered unit would be unaffected. However, while the attack doesn’t kill shrubs, it does break focus, in the sense that in this situation it could unfocus the barrier if it attacked the barrier ward, not the barriered unit.
I'll ask more questions, when i'm not feeling so tired
Inevitable, as this is a complex unit. Considering you’re probably the only one to read the whole thing for a while (except LT and JesusCraig who both saw it before today), I’m okay with you asking questions.
And I also give you the rights of making the first 2 post long unit .

Bwahahaha! I will cherish that distinction (though I think I could effectively argue that you and I are the most long-winded designers here, with LT and CP taking third and fourth, respectively).

[22woger22]

Lol, ok the answers helped a bit, and i'm ready to comment on it :).

I like this unit. Apart from the fact I didn't really understand it properly the first time I read it. I advise you to make several codes for each example (or something close to that), because it just gets annoying to scrolling down the code, when you actually want to scroll down the page. The creativity and tactical usage, is what i'd give high marks for. You could use this offensively (teleport long distances into a turtle (or rush) and make several units attack each other) or defensively (keep the CG at the back of your formation and wait for teleporters to come, and then make them attack each other, and then kill these units while they're still on 1 recovery, or possibly 2 to 3 recovery). It seems pretty balanced too, with the high recovery making up for the long teleporting movement.

This is also a pretty good end game unit (if you have another unit alive), because you can keep on making your enemies recovery to 1 (or more), and keep attacking it with your other unit/s. I like this unit a lot. I wish others would read it all, even if it is long.

My only objection to this unit, is that it may be a little hard to understand. I had to ask several questions, until I actually fully understood this unit.

Otherwise, it's a great, long unit. Well done, Mith :).

[Mithrandir]

Thanks woger, I'm glad you actually read it (course one could argue you owed me after I read your long one :cool: ).

Though I don't know how I could be any clearer, the answers to all but one of your questions are in there. Oh well, maybe next time I try something this ambitious I'll try using the bold function.

[22woger22]

Thanks woger, I'm glad you actually read it (course one could argue you owed me after I read your long one :cool: ).
Yeah, I only read it because I owed you :). Nah, just kidding, I like reading your units, even if they are 2 posts long :).

Though I don't know how I could be any clearer, the answers to all but one of your questions are in there. Oh well, maybe next time I try something this ambitious I'll try using the bold function.
Ah. Well, like I said, I was a bit tired before reading the unit, so I may have missed important information.

[Mithrandir]

Yeah, but as a designer it's my responsibility to make it as easy to understand as possible. Oh well, I did my best.

[22woger22]

I wish more CAU vets will read the good units. it's getting so lonely out here :(.

[Mithrandir]

Yeah, even CP has stopped liking the complicated ones. :(

[Kyir]

I still have the the best, incredably short unit, and, umm good unit, It's still to confuzing, but I only god a hour of sleep so, ill re-read it later

[Mithrandir]

I still have the the best, incredably short unit, and, umm good unit,
What do you believe is the best short unit?
It's still to confuzing, but I only god a hour of sleep so, ill re-read it later
No prob, take your time.

[Wizard__99]

i like the unit idea

[Cross Punisher]

Yeah, even CP has stopped liking the complicated ones. :(
Yeah it was easy during the school year, but now my attention span seems to have shortened, and I just tend to get lost. :(

Uhm for this unit could I use the Chaos Golem on two units and they attack the same unit adding 2 recovery instead of 1?

[Zhou Yu]

This idea is unique in it's way I like that in created units. It basicly uses the power of a unit against them in nearly all forms. The knockback features of the Chaos Golem really shows some prefection. This unit has origonality and I really see that here very well. Manipulating your opponents power against them makes this unit equally balanced even though he's only using the ATTACK force of the units instead of the healing force. If the Chaos Golem could heal, it would make it overpowered in my opinion.

My Rating on the Chaos Golem: 9.75/10

This unit is an excellent unit in my view. I can see myself using this. :D

[Mithrandir]

Thanks much Zhou and Wizard. :)
Yeah it was easy during the school year, but now my attention span seems to have shortened, and I just tend to get lost. :(
Yeah, I know the feeling.
Uhm for this unit could I use the Chaos Golem on two units and they attack the same unit adding 2 recovery instead of 1?
Good question. Apparently I didn't explain something well enough. The recovery isn't added to the unit that the "chaotic" unit attacks, the recovery is added to the "chaotic" unit. So it would be impossible for the Chaos Golem to add 2 recovery to a unit in the same attack.

[Cross Punisher]

Good question. Apparently I didn't explain something well enough.
Nah I probably just missed it this time. :p

[Ice Magic]

This is an insult to me not to you. I just don't think my brain can comprehend the attacks of the chaos golem, maybe when I'm older I'll under stand, after all "With age comes wisdom,"

[Ice Magic]

Mith, can you give me a review on my units, they are called Divine Cleric, Mars Magician, and Wall-Maker Ward. :)

[Cross Punisher]

I've read through this multiple times, and I'm still not sure I understand how the attack pattern works since every example has 1 effected unit attacking 1 cleric, but there are bound to be situations when more than one unit is effected, so my question is could 1 unit be attacked by multiple units under the Chaos Golem's influence getting in 2, 3 or perhaps 4 hits in one turn?

[Mithrandir]

It is not possible for a unit to get hit multiple times in one move from the Chaos Golem because all affected units attack different squares.

All those examples have just one unit being affected but the same principles apply in any scenario. Just keep in mind that a "chaotic" unit moves back to its original place after attacking the square.

I'd like to help you understand it but I'm not sure how else to explain it. Perhaps if we discussed it in a game?

[Cross Punisher]

Oops was I using the wrong "affect?" :eek:

I'd like to help you understand it but I'm not sure how else to explain it. Perhaps if we discussed it in a game?Just one problem, I'm not on my regular computer, I'm on a really old laptop, because I'm not at home plus I'm using AOL which I don't like at all. Everything running slow and it sucks. Sometimes the mouse just clicks on it's own and my typing gets all messed up.

I'm still not sure I like the unit. You get to attack with multiple units in just one turn and they all only have to suffer 1 recovery. I just can't imagine a Dragon Tyrant being able to teleport 2 spaces attack a unit for 28 damage, then teleport back and only have a recovery of 1. That is unless I'm missing something again.

[Mithrandir]

The recovery time of the chaotic units isn't consistent with the way they would normally behave, naturally, but it would be extremely overpowered to make the dragon wait three turns. The primary purpose of the unit is not to delay recovery time but to be able to use a unit or two to attack other units.

[Cross Punisher]

I guess we weren't talking about the same thing after all. I was going by this sentence you said:"The only harm the “used” unit takes is 1 recovery which is added to its wait time (just a one time extra, not a permanent effect)," and thought the whole recovery was just 1 turn but I guess you meant that 1 recovery is added to the total recovery of the affected unit.

So in this example I specified:I just can't imagine a Dragon Tyrant being able to teleport 2 spaces attack a unit for 28 damage, then teleport back and only have a recovery of 1. That is unless I'm missing something again.the Dragon Tyrant would really have a recovery of 4 right?

[JesusCraig]

Cross brings up an interesting scenario.

Are you concerned that people will use the chaos golem to garner additional hits by bypassing full recovery time?

Example: My dragon attacks a scout which is recovering for a turn. The dragon then has a wait time of 3 and the scout of 1, I move in my chaos golem on the next turn and enact its effect, killing the scout.

Also I've asked you this before and you told me that because units return to their original places it was irrelevant, but considering that a unit may die due to damage taken, what is the order which the units attack?

[Mithrandir]

Let me try to just state it explicitly. If the Chaos Golem attacks a dragon that is not recovering, it would end up with a recovery of 1. If the Chaos Golem attacks a dragon that has 3 turns to recover, after the attack it would have a recovery of 4. It does NOT cost the dragon 3 turns to do an attack if it is ordered by the Chaos Golem, something I like about this unit. If you’re clever, you can use it on your own units effectively.
Are you concerned that people will use the chaos golem to garner additional hits by bypassing full recovery time?
If you’re referring to what I just said, then the answer is no, I am not concerned in the least. You would have to be very careful in order to make that work. The target would have to be in just the right place, the dragon would have to be in just the right place and the Chaos Golem would have to move to just the right spot. If you are capable of setting that up so you can attack an enemy unit with your own dragon so your dragon has less recovery than if it did a full attack, you DESERVE that advantage.
Also I've asked you this before and you told me that because units return to their original places it was irrelevant, but considering that a unit may die due to damage taken, what is the order which the units attack?

Actually, that scenario came into my mind last night. My previous statement, that the attack order is irrelevant, still stands but with that twist it needs to be further explained. The attacks go in the same order as the healing from the cleric EXCEPT for that kind of scenario, in which case the order would be altered so the killed unit would go before the surviving unit.

Good questions.