What's behind thread number four?

[Kishin]

Servants to her Majesty herself, this musketeers are proud and powerful soldiers from cross sea. Their weapons were Illustrate by barbarian warriors as thunder or fire sticks. Trained in hand to hand and with their powerful weapon. These new bread of warriors have taken the world by storm, forever changing the face of battle.

Musketeer’s wear something similar to the traditional soldier uniform associated with the British soldiers in the American, War of Independence.

Name: Musketeer
Health: 35
Attack: 23
Armor: --
Recovery: Moving=1, Attacking=2(1), Loading =1
Blocking: 25% Front 15% sides
Movement: 2 (Since they are weighed down with so much equipment rather than armor, their movement is restricted.)
Attack Range: 10 (Los Applies)
Attack Notes: The Musketeer attacks with a black power rifle. These rifles are powerful and have a great distance. Their only downside is that they are very inaccurate. The hit percentage to distance ratios are below;
100% / 1-2
90% / 3-4
70% / 5
60% / 6
50% / 7
40% / 8
30% / 9
20%/10
(Percentage / Distance)
Attack Methods/Special Abilities:
There are four different attack methods total, listed below.

Fire- A powerful and very long ranged attack.

Bayonet: After a show has been fired the rifle is useless, but the Musketeer is no push over, after he has fired his rifle he can charge into the fight and deal a blockable 15 damage. Since he is not firing his rifle, he only has to wait One turn if attacking. Two if moving and attacking. (Will equip bayonet after the shot is fired, and removed when he reloads.)

Reload: This attack takes one full turn to perform. With so many steps and careful mixtures of powders a musketeer is well trained and can perform this task fairly quickly.
(To activate this attack hold down on the Musketeer when his rifle is empty until his attack pattern turns to himself. Let go and the Musketeer will reload his rifle.)

Ready! Aim!: This method of attack requires a loaded rifle. The attack will reduce the Musketeers attack range to Four, but he will have a 100% chance to hit any unit within that range, with deadly marksmanship. Increased damage to 30.
(To activate hold down on the musketeer until his attack range of ten changes to four, and select a target within that area. Once a musketeer has taken aim, he cannot target a unit outside of his 4 tile range.)


Offensive Strategy: Limitless….
Defensive Strategy: Limitless….

Comments: With a range of ten, a musketeer can dish out some good damage to units hidden behind enemy lines with a little luck. When a unit dares to get close enough, the musketeer will make him think twice about further advancement after setting his sights on him. A great unit in the hands of a good player, but USELESS to a new player. With suck low health and armor, two good hits plus his very long wait time, and he is done. Use cautiously, or he will be killed with ease.

[Morning Star]

Wow I have not reasearched this idea to see if others have come up with it (I have actually been working on a Unit with similar attack range), but this is a very neat idea. I think his recovery time is incredibly long though +4 for attacking and another +1 to reload means u have basically 6 tuns to kill this guy before he can get another shot off. I like the close range melee idea too but maybe the 18 attack is too high for him? Maybe around 15 or so. Even with an attack range of 10, with such a short movement range, no defence and low HP its hard to see this guy really being a factor in anyones set. I think this is a really cool idea. :cool:

[Kyir]

so at close range he has a ok chance to hit for 43 damage? even armor reducable thats way to much, and he still has a 10% chance to kill a cleric from 10 squares, more luck, and more for idiots to whine about

[Kishin]

This is what you get for snooring in math class XP 43? Where in the heck did you get 43?

Increase damage TO, TO 30, not add on 30 damage to existing power.

[Morning Star]

90% / 1-2
80% / 3-4
50% / 5
40% / 6
30% / 7
20% / 8
10 % / 9-10
(Percentage / Distance)

I really dont like this however. So ur basically saying that with any unit that this guy is next to he will almost always hit. This guy basically changes the way everyone blocks up front. (ex. knight has 24 hp and the musketeer is 4 spaces away and takes a front shot, result, that knight is dead on what is supposed to be a 20% chance of "anyone" hitting him except from unblockable attack units.)

The attack will reduce the Musketeers attack range to Four, but he will have a 100% chance to hit any unit within that range, with deadly marksmanship. Increased damage to 30

Im not a fan off guaranteed hits especially with a guy that has an attack of 30! The DT is bad enough lol. So he can do this move everytime?! Is there a different recovery time for using this special?

[legacy67]

Unique, but I find this unit to be too busy.

First off, with 3 different attack methods, the logistical problems of programming would be endless, but that is neither here nor there as we are discussing the merits of the units despite the fact that they are unlikely to be made.

I will review each attack separately.

1. Fire: I think that I would find myself never using this attack, especially when I have the much more reliable and stronger "ready, aim" attack (which I will get to momentarily. Within the range of 4, in which the "ready, aim" attack is useable, the "fire" attack does 5 less damage, and has the chance to miss 10-20% of the time. So in close range, there is no contest. Then, once you get beyond that, the chance of missing with the longer attacks makes using them a liability, especailly when the recovery is 4. If you side attack a Pyro from 5 spaces away, you have a 50% chance of hitting it, with a 16% chance the pyro will block the attack if you do manage to hit it. That mean only a 42% chance of hitting the pyro with a side attack from 5 squares. In short, the ranged attack quickly becomes useless. At six squares, it is the equivalent of a front attack on a scout, at 7 squares you have a 30% chance of hitting, the same as a front attack on an assasin, and at 8 squares you have a 20% chance of hitting, same as a front shot on a knight. At nine to ten squares, your chances of hitting are the same as the chance that a DMW will get a side block. Pretty bad odds. These number basically make the "fire" attack completely undesireable.

2. Ready! Aim! : As you may have expected it, I will refer to this as the magekiller attack. With 30 damage, this guy has a one shot kill. Not only that, but from your description, it appears that the attack is unblocakble, which effectively makes this a moveable LW. Now I know that the wait time and reloading heavil weakens these attacks, but I will get to that later. Even with his recovery times, keeping him in the back to pick off rushers could be very strong.

3. Bayonet: There is nothing new here. I like the fact that this unit is versatile, but this melee attack basically turns the Musketeer into a Scout with no ranged attack. I can't really imagine myself using this with ay frequency, unless there was a unit that could be killed with one bayonet hit. even then, the timing would have to work perfectly with the 4 wait time.

4. Reload: While I see how this integrates with the bayonet attack, I think that it is superfluous when you take into account that fact that this unit has a wait of 4. The wait of 4 already makes using this unit nearly always sacraficial, but the reload also makes him even more ineffective. A 5 turn wait between using your primary attack is just too long.

The wait time with this unit is really too long. I understand the need to temper hi extremely high attacks with something, but this wait time all but garuntees that you will not get the "ready! Aim!" attack off more than once, and the ineffectiveness of the "Fire" attack means that it will be nearly impossible to use the unit effectively from an area in which it will not be sacraficial.

My main thoughts come down to this. First, the "fire" attack is just too unreliable, but if you make it an attack you can actually use, a range to 10 is too far. It would basically give the unit the ability to stand out of harms way and pick people off. Secondly, this unit is killed much to easily, it is basically a sitting duck it if ever does an attack worth using. You could argue the merits of making a trade, but I don't like units made purely for sacrafice. I like the ability to change between a ranged attack and a differently effective melee attack, but I do not belive that this unit does that effectively. I feel that the melee attack should be the more powerful of the two as the unit is better able to aim and control the attack. The only way that I can see the "fire" attack being good is if the it is not the % that goes down over distance, but he damage. Even then the ability to hit for ANY damage from 10 squares is too strong ( I see the GA and Musketeer being doubly annoying here.

Having a versatile unit is good, moving away from one-dimensionaly to 2 or 3 dimensional characters shows innovation, but this unit does not do it in an effective way.

Well explained, good concept, just misexecuted.

C+

[Sodamoeba]

so, he has a 100% chance of dealing 30 damage to anything within 4 spaces...its like a powered up LW, which is not so good...

[Sodamoeba]

so, he has a 100% chance of dealing 30 damage to anything within 4 spaces...its like a powered up LW, which is not so good...I guess I cant complain about anything else, except his real range is probably about 4 or 5 max...I mean who would take a 10% chance of hitting, and, on top of that, have a chance at it being BLOCKED? not I


EDIT: Dam i thought i used the edit button! forgive the double post :( actually i did use the edit button...I dont know what happened :confused:

[Kyir]

This is what you get for snooring in math class XP 43? Where in the heck did you get 43?

Increase damage TO, TO 30, not add on 30 damage to existing power.
><, thought it was a 28 power shot and tohught you could bayonet on the same turn you shot

[Kishin]

All Valid Concerns, but I'm two steps ahead of all of you ^_^


I really dont like this however. So ur basically saying that with any unit that this guy is next to he will almost always hit. This guy basically changes the way everyone blocks up front. (ex. knight has 24 hp and the musketeer is 4 spaces away and takes a front shot, result, that knight is dead on what is supposed to be a 20% chance of "anyone" hitting him except from unblockable attack units[/quote

It's not how they block it's his accuracy. With a weapon that strong, that can do this much damage up to 10 spaces away? That's damn near the entire field no matter where he stands. He HAS to have a lower accuracy as the distance increases. When designing the character I thought of many things.

IF he had a guanteed hit that far away, Blocking would have to be included. Well then I though,what about units that couldn't block? The abuse would be outragous, he could pick off a priest with hardly any problems from the get go. (People do that anyways with posion wisps and golem ambushers, but still.) These odd are in place to prevent a player from abusing his power and abilites. Yet there is still a CHANCE he can hit from that far away. Basically, it's like trying to pick off a knight with a scout situation at maximum range.


[Quote=Legacy67]1. Fire: I think that I would find myself never using this attack, especially when I have the much more reliable and stronger "ready, aim" attack (which I will get to momentarily. Within the range of 4, in which the "ready, aim" attack is useable, the "fire" attack does 5 less damage, and has the chance to miss 10-20% of the time. So in close range, there is no contest. Then, once you get beyond that, the chance of missing with the longer attacks makes using them a liability, especailly when the recovery is 4. If you side attack a Pyro from 5 spaces away, you have a 50% chance of hitting it, with a 16% chance the pyro will block the attack if you do manage to hit it. That mean only a 42% chance of hitting the pyro with a side attack from 5 squares. In short, the ranged attack quickly becomes useless. At six squares, it is the equivalent of a front attack on a scout, at 7 squares you have a 30% chance of hitting, the same as a front attack on an assasin, and at 8 squares you have a 20% chance of hitting, same as a front shot on a knight. At nine to ten squares, your chances of hitting are the same as the chance that a DMW will get a side block. Pretty bad odds. These number basically make the "fire" attack completely undesireable.

The shot is unblockable, no matter how you use it. The statistics are based completly on his accuracy. This is in place to prevent someone from placing a musketeer on the back row, and picking off units with ease.

2. Ready! Aim! : As you may have expected it, I will refer to this as the magekiller attack. With 30 damage, this guy has a one shot kill. Not only that, but from your description, it appears that the attack is unblocakble, which effectively makes this a moveable LW. Now I know that the wait time and reloading heavil weakens these attacks, but I will get to that later. Even with his recovery times, keeping him in the back to pick off rushers could be very strong.

Maybe so, But by doing so you can pretty much guarentee that you will also sacrafice this unit as well after he fires. With such a long wait period, reload time. You have to use him carefully, and strategically. If your a reckless player, he's of no use to you unless you get lucky. I would find this unit MUCH MUCH more valuable than any of my others and would protect him at any cost. I would not trade him for a pryo or a witch unless I had too. Say to protect my priest from a dark witch. Doing this attack in teh begging of the game, means you intend to trade him. If used right, he is much more valuable than many of your other units.

3. Bayonet: There is nothing new here. I like the fact that this unit is versatile, but this melee attack basically turns the Musketeer into a Scout with no ranged attack. I can't really imagine myself using this with ay frequency, unless there was a unit that could be killed with one bayonet hit. even then, the timing would have to work perfectly with the 4 wait time.

Thier is no four turn wait with the bayonet, it's only two. This would mean if he doesn't have time to reload, he can at least deal out some damage before he gets killed.

4. Reload: While I see how this integrates with the bayonet attack, I think that it is superfluous when you take into account that fact that this unit has a wait of 4. The wait of 4 already makes using this unit nearly always sacraficial, but the reload also makes him even more ineffective. A 5 turn wait between using your primary attack is just too long.
Well



To your last comments. The accurrecy level is to PREVENT him from sitting back and picking units off with ease. That requires chance, and with that much wait time, a seasoned player would know that's just not worth losing my unit over doing some damage.

Such as (I see this alot from new players) Moving a dw in range of a Lw, to attack a row of knights, with no means off follow up attacks to finish them off. His usage is not to trade, no he adds much more to the game than just a trading unit. He could add a much deeper stratigic level to attacking. If I were to use him offensivly, well I wouldn't unless the chance was worth taking. Defensivly, I'd have him behind the lines, and wait for a unit to get within his range, ready, aim, than barrair. Reload, and move on to attack with him. Look at it as an equation.
Attack = A
Wait= W
Distance= D

(A+D-W= No Chance of abuse, or easy kills.)
His special ability Ready aim, is risky and should only be used under correct circumstances.

Don't get me wrong I do agree he does have to wait a long time in order to attack again, but with the distance he can attack? He should have to wait a total of 5-6 turns in order to attack again. A scout has a range of 6 with 18 attack. And it's blockable, a balanced wait 2 turns. 1 if he doesn't move and attacks.
A musketeer is far more powerful. A range of ten with 25 attack.
a four turn wait is perfect for him. This keeps him balanced. Not to mention his attack is unblockable no matter what.
Ready Aim, is useful... but limited use. Your much better taking your chances to do some damange to lesser armored enemies at a distance, than getting in close and sacraficing him. At close range, he's deadly, meduim range, he's very useful, and far range, limited. Not to mention line of sight applies, who is to say he will have a clear shot from the back, with only a two movement, an enemy can totally reconfigure his setup to prevent a clear shot to weaker units.



so, he has a 100% chance of dealing 30 damage to anything within 4 spaces...its like a powered up LW, which is not so good...
A Lw has a 100% blocking from all sides. and doesn't have to wait up to 5, six turns to attack again. This units has many setbacks that keep it from being overpowered, I'm actually suprised people have mentioned it to be overpowered.

><, thought it was a 28 power shot and tohught you could bayonet on the same turn you shot

XP Okay... Now where the heck did you get the idea he attacks twice per turn? =P

[Sodamoeba]

lol sure make fun of me...but in all seriousness, what the point of having 10 range if you wont use it? Honestly...just take that range out. Maybe make 1-2 100% 3-4 80% and 5-6 60% and maybe 7-8 40% if you must and whatnot...noone in their right minds would use an attack that only had a 40% chance of hitting (or less) without even factoring in blocking. Thanks for responding to criticism though, I hate authors who dont do that, or who do it rudely :mad: Id rep ya but apparently I already have...

[Kishin]

lol sure make fun of me...but in all seriousness, what the point of having 10 range if you wont use it? Honestly...just take that range out. Maybe make 1-2 100% 3-4 80% and 5-6 60% and maybe 7-8 40% if you must and whatnot...noone in their right minds would use an attack that only had a 40% chance of hitting (or less) without even factoring in blocking. Thanks for responding to criticism though, I hate authors who dont do that, or who do it rudely :mad: Id rep ya but apparently I already have...

I made fun of you?? 0_o Wha?! Lay off the crack!

Okay imagine this... I put this unit on the front line. Advance him two spaces, I'm withing six, maybe seven spaces of your priest. Do you want me to have a 60% or Fourty % of picking YOUR priest off from the get go?

[Sodamoeba]

good point...thats why Seed didnt make units with a range of 7 :p

[CRX687]

A new long range attacker... for starters, you should make it so that if you use this, one busher or scout cannot be used.

The original idea is just fine, don't add the 3 attack stuff to it... that's just unnecessary. The bayonet gives it doubut range, so everything directly next to musketeer will be attacked with the bayo for a blockable 15.

Muskets have an optimum range, so to be realistic, everything from 2 to 4 squares away should have 100% unblockable. Then 1/2 the % for each square from then on. Giving it literally infinite range... but LOS applies and by square #8 the chances of hitting are so low it's literally a waste of an attack... but it would be up to the player to try for the luck or not.

To balance out the unblockablility and the ignoring of opponent blocking, lower the power so that there is no 1 hit cleric kill if you put this in the front line at the start... perhaps change the atk to 23 instead.

At least, that's how I'd go about fixing this unit. It's a great concept, the ignoring of opponent blocking and using hit ratios to limit range.

The loading is just... unecessary... make it a 2 turn atk recovery and 1 turn move, you assume the man'd start the battle with a loaded gun, and the rest of the loading comes AFTER he shoots durign the recovery time.

[Kyir]

XP Okay... Now where the heck did you get the idea he attacks twice per turn? =P

because I've decided to act stupid on all of you posts :rolleyes:

I WAS HALF ASLEEP

[Mike...]

lol sure make fun of me...but in all seriousness, what the point of having 10 range if you wont use it? Honestly...just take that range out. Maybe make 1-2 100% 3-4 80% and 5-6 60% and maybe 7-8 40% if you must and whatnot...noone in their right minds would use an attack that only had a 40% chance of hitting (or less) without even factoring in blocking. Thanks for responding to criticism though, I hate authors who dont do that, or who do it rudely :mad: Id rep ya but apparently I already have...

duble post!!!!1!!111!!!!!!one!!!11!!!!! :mad: :mad:
burn him!!!!!!!!!!:fire:

[wolf-boy]

noob post, neg mike!!

[Kishin]

because I've decided to act stupid on all of you posts :rolleyes:

I WAS HALF ASLEEP

XP

Anyway I made a few changes.
Wait time has been lowered, to two turns after firing, reloading time still applies.
Accuracy has been lifted some and modified. Because of this the attack was lowered to prevent a one hit cleric kill.

[doubledown]

Actually a very well thought out unit. I have to congratulate you on coming up with an original and balanced unit....however....
1) Muskets just dont fit the theme of swords and magic
2) He is way too complex. With so many different attack types and different circumstances he will be put in, it would mean an incredible amount of programming, and I dont even think the engine could handle it all.