Dragoon (Revised)

[Mishra]

The Dragoon's were a group of human's with Dragon ansetory. They themselves were far to diluted to show any Draconic traits (wings breath weapons etc.) but were more than formitable with their spears and lances. They took up arms in wars for money. They asked for little, and were hired only in times of real distress, for they were a very bloodthirsty bunch. The Dragoons eventually, with the help of a cabal of sorcerers, were able to harness their draconic powers and form them into a devistating physical leaping attack. After this they became arrogant, and were hunted by the mass populations of the world. Their numbers began to dwindle, so like their Dragon ansestors, they went into hibrination. They have once again begun to emerge. Once again this is not final, with enough protests I will drop something or make something work diferently. Please leave feedback, not just I don/'t like the unit. If you don't like it explain why it is that you don't like it.


Unit Name: Dragoon

HP: 45
Armor: 18
Power: 20
Blocking: 60%/30%
Attack Range: (Normal Attack) Beast Rider (Leaping Attack) Pyromancer grid
Movement: 4
Wait: 1

Note: The normal attack is blockable and reductible by armor. This attack does not penetrate. If the first square is empty, and you choose this square the Dragoon will bypass it and hit the next square up. This comes from his thirst for blood.

Leap Attack: This attack is triggered the same way the mud-golems 'Mud-Quake' is triggered. Once it has been triggered you will then recieve a grid (pyro grid. This attack only hits one unit.) to choose your unit selection from. The unit that you choose must have the square directly in front of him open because the Dragoon lands in that square.(determined by which direction the selected unit is facing. A unit must be selected for the Dragoon to use the leap attack, he cannot leap onto an empty square.) The attack is not blockable but is reducible by damage. Any effects that were on the Dragoon (The only one I can think of is Stoning) when he uses the leap attack are nulled due to the rush of Draconic and Magical powers. (Basicaly this attack causes him to focus so much that he loses the Golems effect because the Sorcerers had to focus the power completely from magical forces. This attack may not be used on a Dragon Tyrant. (While the Dragoon will kill a dragon, he will not show his ansestory to one. So his leap attack can not be used on a Dragon Tyrant.) This attack does not require line of sight.

There. I was told to put at least a half of an hour into my units, and this is the first of two that I am redoing. I started a new thread simply because the other thread was at like 5 pages of nothing but arguing. I spent an hour looking at this unit. Maybe this will be a little better than the last time.

[Snowy1]

and i think a wait of 1 is a bit short, maybe 2?

[Jago Fett]

My god that is off the final fantisy games .

[JesusCraig]

Sigh, too bad it degenerated into this so quickly :P Jago, dragoons existed long before final fantasy, actually they still exist, view the other thread for a actual definition of a dragoon. And don't post if you don't add anything to the conversation.

Alright Mishra, you got a usable unit now. Your missing some key details though. Whats the initial attacks power? By a pyro grid do you mean his range or his effect grid? the range grid is the 3 in each direction, the effect grid is the cross shaped pattern. I assume you mean the range grid.

[Mishra]

Yes I ment the range grid. I should have been more spacific on that one. I have the power of the attack wrote down on my paper, and Soon on the description as well. I'm not sure why it is that I forgot to put that in there. Both attacks are at the same power though.

[JesusCraig]

Not bad at all, wouldn't mind seeing it replace the beast rider as a gold unit, accomplishes the same feats with a better ability to do so.

You should submit it for gold certification.

[Mishra]

I'm new to this board...how do I do this?

[JesusCraig]

Just post the link in the CAU Committee thread: under new management.

We're a bunch of old and new blowhards who think we know what we're doing :D

[Mishra]

alrighty then. I'll send set it up for gold certification then.

[JesusCraig]

Anything for a fellow arcadian knight.

[Mishra]

Anyone else care to comment on the unit? Or do I just go off JesusCraig? C'mon I know there has to be someone with something to say about it!

[Forest_Archer]

2 threads about one unit? I'd call that unit spam. It bumps the other threads downward. Please don't do it again

[Executioner]

I like this much better, its seems to have just the right toughness considering the way it attacks, its power is ok and i like the way the attack works now. Good job Mishra.

Exe

[Kyir]

F_A, for once please shut up, walrus did that same tihng and no one bugged him

as to the unit:
Definatly better then the last one, its useable and not overpowered, in the future you might want to explain in detial what you ment instead of (beastrider), thats obviosu, but some other wouldent be. And by directly infront of do you mean the frontal cone? or in the squares directly infront.

[Forest_Archer]

Um.. what did I do, Kyir? Maybe I actually want my threads to live and not die? Or maybe I should join the crowd and make revisions on new threads. Whatever happened to the edit button?

[Mishra]

the edit button was kind of pointless considering the fact that the enire unit was basically shit, and there were ongoing arguemnts on the thread. This is just my wya of getting rid of those little squabbles. As per the fact that I do not have the ability to delete posts off of my threads, this was my alternative. now if you would be so kind as to say something regarding the unit the next time you post on here that would be just awesome!

[Deck of Jesters]

Burn.

Anyway, onto the subject of this thread.

This unit is essentially an extremely powerful Pyromancer. Not a bad concept, but with 20 power and a wait of 1, this decimates the DSM (does 40 damage to the same squares in the same amount of time a DSM can do 27), and is more likely to survive than the DSM. Maybe if you reverse the Blockability (make the Beast Rider attack Unblockable, and the Leap Attack Blockable), it could balance it out somewhat.

[Mishra]

that was the origninal idea, but I have found from personal experience that when someone jumps at you, it is much harder to block the attack.the only real way to accomplish this is to back up. Thats why the attack is unblockable and the other is blockable. as with the DSM and Dragoon thing, the DSM can only do 27, while the Dragoon can do 20, the DSM hits max of 5 units, the Dragoon can only hit one. I'm not sure what to really think about it, If I get any more complaints about it I'll change it though.

[Chaosti]

There are some clarifications I need, before I can judge this for Gold Cert. First, by pyromancer grid, do you mean it attacks an square within 3 spaces, or does it mean that it attacks any square within 3 spaces with a cross pattern? I'm assuming that the space in front of the target unit must be empty because that is where the Dragoon will land, though you may want to include that detail in your description. I'll save my criticisms for the Certification thread.

[Mishra]

Yes it attacks any ONE square uin the range of the attack, and the Position directly in front of the unit that it attacks is where it lands which is why it has to be empty. I will clarify these things on the discritions.

[Deck of Jesters]

oOo, ok, when you said Pyromancer pattern, I thought you meant it hit all the tiles a Pyromancer does. Nvm then, it's good as it is.

Edit: ok, I suppose this post deserved a neg... why?

[Mishra]

Glad that you like it. At least somewhat. Maybe we can get some more people on here to look at this thing. I'm still going for gold cert. with it, and I'd like to hear the thoughts of everyone.

[Kyir]

Um.. what did I do, Kyir? Maybe I actually want my threads to live and not die? Or maybe I should join the crowd and make revisions on new threads. Whatever happened to the edit button?

Its 2 theads, find a valid reason to bump your unit and leave this alone

[Mishra]

anyone like to comment on the unit not someone else? Or would that be to much to ask?

[Kyir]

you never responed to my comment :D

[Mishra]

My fault...I must have missed it. it is the square directly in front of the targeted unit. the square is determined by which direction the unit is facing. So if it has someone in front of him, then it can not be Leap attacked.

[Kyir]

so are you saying the path of the attack follows LoS or just


00A00 0=empty
00000 A= attacked unit
00B00 B=blocking unit
00d00 d=dragoon


in this case the dragoon may not attack, its late at night here, i'll look again tomorow

[Mishra]

On LoS questions please read the discription of the attacks. I made sure it was in there when I wrote it.

[Walrus]

not bad, nothing earth-shattering, but thats not necessarily a bad thing. this unit has enough depth to it to make it original, but isnt so complex that....well im not going to go into that again, suffice to say its "complexity level" is about right i think.

stats-wise it certainly seems pretty balanced. initially i thought it might be a bit overpowered with high movement and attack range, coupled with pretty good damage. this is still somewhat of an issue i think, ie it is very strong in 1-on-1 situations.
i could see a unit like this basically holding the same spots in a formation as a beast rider or assassin. although whether it would be used is another issue, the fact that the leap attack dispels stoning means there is no point stoning it (obviously) and hence it becomes fairly weak defensively.

finally, the leap attack is interesting, and whilst it does open up opportunities for catching/blocking running units, the problem with it in this respect is that you can only get a front hit from it. with 4 movement anyway, you can always get a side hit on the unit you intend to attack, so its not really worth using the leap attack except for units a long way away that can only be reached from moving and leaping (assuming you can do both in 1 turn)


overall, pretty good job, like i said in the 1st sentence, not earth shattering, but simple and effective, which is important in a unit.

[legacy67]

First off, a ranged attack with a range of 4, 20 power, and only 1 recovery seems a bit strong, but i need to think about it some more.

My real questions (and the ones that everyone knows are coming) relate to strategy.

1. What is the tactical value of this unit? What role will it play that is not already being used?

2. What unit in your current Gold formation would you sacrafice to use this unit? (If you don't use a beast rider in your form, then don't say beast rider). What sort of formation would you create when using this unit? Where would it be placed in relationship to Unit Here?

3. What will be some useful strategic hints for using this unit? (ie. LOS trick shots for the scout, taking 2 turns to flank with the knight, proper placement of a wisp, etc.)

These are just a few questions that need to be answered. Many units may be intersting and balanced, but do they have a place in TAO?

[Deck of Jesters]

Legacy, you ought to just copy that and paste it in every single one of your posts :p

[Mishra]

First off, a ranged attack with a range of 4, 20 power, and only 1 recovery seems a bit strong, but i need to think about it some more.

My real questions (and the ones that everyone knows are coming) relate to strategy.

1. What is the tactical value of this unit? What role will it play that is not already being used?

2. What unit in your current Gold formation would you sacrafice to use this unit? (If you don't use a beast rider in your form, then don't say beast rider). What sort of formation would you create when using this unit? Where would it be placed in relationship to Unit Here?

3. What will be some useful strategic hints for using this unit? (ie. LOS trick shots for the scout, taking 2 turns to flank with the knight, proper placement of a wisp, etc.)

These are just a few questions that need to be answered. Many units may be intersting and balanced, but do they have a place in TAO?

What is the tactical value of this unit?

What is the tactical value of a knight? This unit is basicaly used for the intial ass whippping. You don't send a scout into the fray, and I don't use knights very much, they tend to be a little to picked on for my likeing. This unit is designed to eb able to wade in and smash up things before they get the chance to do a significant amount of damage to anything you got sitting on your side of the board. (the same as a Knight.) If you send something over to enemy territory, then you have they time to set up a wave attack. He is a power unit, kind of like the knight, only with his own set of strenghs and weakness'.

What in your current formation would you drop to put the Dragoon in?

I would gladly drop a single one of my scouts fr this unit. My set up would kill for this thing it is already working fairly well, but if the Dragoon was hanging out on my side of the board daring your units to come over for my DSM, it would run alot better. I would have it set up in my third row probably four from the corner. Sitting just beside my mud Golem, and just in front of my remaining scout, just behind my Pyro, DSM, and Wisp, and next to my Ambusher Golem.

What would be some useful strategic tips for using this unit?

As with all units, a useful tip would be placement. If he is placed to close to the front, he stands a chance of having his wings clipped a buit eairly. Hawever if he is placed to far back then he won't be doing very well either. You have to find a medium with him, as with all of your units. My best tip with him would be to start him off in the third row, like I said, (plenty of movement range, and not to mention the leap attack) From there pair him with a scout on the front row guarded by a muddy, and just start picking off their ranged units forcing them to charge hand to hand, or hide behind a lightning ward, or frostie. Either way the remainder of your units should have no problem dealing with the remaning units even if the dragoon bites the dust.


I'll take a screenshot of a set-up for you guys and have it posted in here within about 4 hours or so. I have a few other things to do, then I'll be happy to punch out a working Dragoon set-up. (it's my anniversary today.)

[Mishra]

I know I know don't double post...I had to because I got the set-up pic uploaded, and the edit button is the bane of my existance. Not really I'm just in a hurry and here the set-up is I'm heading out now.




http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b149/DearduffCR/DragoonFormation.jpg


there you go. That would be an effective setup for the Dragoon to be used in. The Dragoon is pictured in the setup as the Beast Rider for those who can't figure it out. Yes it is small, but here is the units in order from back to front Right to left (from their point of view) Cleric, Dragon Tyrant, Frost Golem, Scout, Scout, Dragoon, Dragonspeaker Mage, Pyromancer, Poision Wisp.

[Deck of Jesters]

Remove the .th from the (near) end of the url, and it'll increase the size of the image.

[Walrus]

there is no .th near the end according to the pages source code

[Deck of Jesters]

Oh, he's still using photobucket :x noob hosting site, if you ask me... use www.imageshack.us, they are considerably better.

[Mishra]

Oh, he's still using photobucket :x noob hosting site, if you ask me... use www.imageshack.us, they are considerably better.


I was just being lazy and trying to get it up on there so I could do other things. It was my anniversary, and I was wanting to go and be with my girlfriend, so fuilling out applications for another hosting site was just pointless, and I was busy doing ohter things. Therefore Photobucket was the only choice I had. I was using it a long long time ago.

[Deck of Jesters]

lol, I'm not saying you are a noob for using it, I used to use it too :) imageshack doesn't have a signup sheet, you just upload it, nothing to fill out :D It's a beautiful thing.

[Mishra]

Well, this would require though, which would require time, which would inevitably have made me late for the mallratting that we did. No money really, so nothing spectacular, just your basic mallratting. Window shopped and that was about all, but who would want to be late for that? She was trying on cloths and stuff...nothing beats seeing the chick that you think is hot trying on cloths for you.

[Deck of Jesters]

How about when she tries taking them off for you? I should think that beats her putting them on :p

[Mishra]

That is beside the point and none of your business, but I did enjoy that day alot. It was rather fun for me!

[Mishra]

More input is still needed. I know I double posted, but this thing was burried under like 20 other units, and on the second page, which would mean that very few if any people would ever see it again, and I need to know what more people think of the unit.

[Walrus]

the unit has 41 replies (42 now). more input is not needed.

[Mishra]

yes it does because there is apparently still problems with my unit.

[Kyir]

there are always problems, let this die and make another, stop being a Walrus

[Walrus]

clearly since regardless of whether i actually bump any units or not, people still complain at me, i may as well just start bumping them again

[Kyir]

I'm not complaining

[Walrus]

i am complaining then.

[Chlamydia[StDS]]

I am new to TacticsArena as well as thier forums..but I noticed in the create a unit forum Dragoon...In all the games I have played a Dragoon was a very good charecter but I believe you used his Ability more like a Lancers Abilites....The wait time of 1 should be more like 2 and if he uses his special the wait time should be 3....just some more details from a Newbie:D

I like the idea though Mishra :)