enchantress rush

[TheGuy]

I was screwing around and won with it. I put her on the front row with BW in the middle of the board behind a LW and some knights. She can take a hit from any unit on the board, so if it's a good situation she moves in, paralyzes 3/4s of the enemy team, then is barriered.

It won't work 9/10 times, but it sure was fun. :D I feel like with some starting setup changes, I could make it happen. Anyone ever do this? Any forms based on it?

[TurtleKaze]

It won't work 9/10 times

more like 99/100 times. Enchantress freezes, enchantress gets shot... No barrier.

[Triple]

I suppose it would be allright if u had a few chanty and bw's and were playing against someone with not many ranged ppl, like a grey. I played a 1100 grey once who had 2 chantys and a bw upfront, I won but It put me in some tight spots. I suppose it would depend on how the forms matched up and who you were playing. I wouldnt recommnd using a set like that and expecting to win.

[dab00z]

I won with 4 enchantresses 5 witches and a pyro on my grey recently against some 1200s, it was pretty funny. I had them all up front and it worked out pretty well.

[TheGuy]

I was thinking it could really help in every game because a) if you have two enchantresses, you can afford to potentially sacrifice one in the same way people will sacrifice mages to get to the cleric, b) she can take a hit from any unit on the board, so if she just can't contribute anything she can run, and c) she can act as a deterant in the same way a LW does-- you don't have to actually use her. She'll claim the entire middle of the board if shes barriered. You just have to make sure his scout can't reach her then turn her loose.

The first guy I tried it on, I moved in and snagged 2 knights, a LW and his scout. If you can get the scout, you've got a good chance at making it work.

[Noda]

yeh, actually, ask jugs, admiralty, or lord ducki about how well an offensive chanty setup works :)

it use to be my normal one, works fine with one enchantress, two it really is just my personal perfect form.

best setup for offensive chanty is the "v" form with two knights on top then the enchantress one behind.

it takes patiance, the rest of the form was pretty much a rush, so by me attackign fast i could usually deter the attention away from the enchantress untill i had set up the knights to freeze stuff properly.

[tarvos 6]

I just played with a 1387 grey and he had 3 chantys up front and 3 knights , a scout, a BW, lw and a cleric, unfortunately I got dc, but he had me in a pretty tight spot anyway, he used them well, he sent 2 knights towards my back row in an effort to tie up my scout, and then he froze my LW and BW and then he froze 2 of my 3 knights, and eventually had the third frozen with 2 of his knights frozen all together. He played really well.

tarvos 6

[Demon Soldier]

I was screwing around and won with it. I put her on the front row with BW in the middle of the board behind a LW and some knights. She can take a hit from any unit on the board, so if it's a good situation she moves in, paralyzes 3/4s of the enemy team, then is barriered.

It won't work 9/10 times, but it sure was fun. :D I feel like with some starting setup changes, I could make it happen. Anyone ever do this? Any forms based on it?
well, good strategy, if you freze the scout and all the other long range attackers. But you would then have to worry about your BW getting shot and then that leaves your chanty open for an attack. never try this setup with a gold though. If I may be soe bold to make a suggestion, you might want to have TWO barrier wards, with the second one gaurded from all sides and diagonalls, or just guard the first on. see the diagram that i drew for it. It is a good strategy if the opponents setup is right for it. IF!


x=barrier ward
o=your other units
e=enchantress

xxx
xox
xxx
e


oh, and one more thing. Luck will have to favor you because if you move second, you would be in a very grave situation and you would probably lose, but this, with proper thought, could become a very powerful setup! As tarvos probably wanted you to see, it is a very good strategy to use the chanty, if you have been playing for a long time.

Happy battling!

[Noda]

well, "never try this against a gold".

actually, not to be a dick, but i actually believe that an offensive chanty might be the best setup against a gold. id have to look to find all the golds id beaten with that offensive chanty setup.

but search lost to it twice

[deleryn]

I had a five-chanty-up-front form going on for a while, but it died with the wipe. It was not the most flawless strategy ever, but it was quite a bit of fun. The idea behind that strategy was that you would sacrifice a few of them so that the rest were in good positions for freezing the majority of the enemy's force. After ranged units were dead/frozen (I did have two witches and a scout at my disposal with it), most melee could be dealt with fairly easily in most cases.

I never did get a second barrier ward. I had seven witches and five chanties going for a while, but never two barrier wards. I usually had to make due without them, but this was just for fun anyways. I would never use something like this seriously, mostly because the strategy hasn't been *perfected* and also because I'm digging the mobility of the default formation right now.

Anyways, here's some pics:

the form (http://members.cox.net/dpott/chantyr1.JPEG)
one of the first non-noob wins (http://members.cox.net/dpott/chantywitchwin.JPG)
froze the cleric! (http://members.cox.net/dpott/clericfreeze.JPG)

[TheGuy]

That last picture is pretty funny, deleryn, and the first one scares the crap out of me. :bigsmile: That many enchantresses is a huge advantage because a lot of people only have 2 ranged units and a LW.

[uniquinous]

I dunno - I've played a decent number of chanty rushes and have yet to find one that works well against my setup. Perhaps it's cuz I'm a chanty user myself? I dunno - I just haven't quite seen it work yet. It seems like you'd just have to hope the opponents setup happened to be vulnerable to yours from the start for this to work, and I really don't rely on luck or first-turn when looking into a strat. Sorry. =( She's great, but my cleric gets lonely without her.

[deleryn]

Once units start moving around, the strategy starts getting exciting. You might only see the start of the battle for it, and most people only think that far. Luck and the enemy's form do play a large role in it, but the key to winning with it is to make them pay for every move that they make. There are ways to block her from a scout's arrow, and if they actually use the scout offensively, the chanty rusher can often get him. Remember that the scout can only shoot once every three turns and the mages have range, long recovery, and movement restrictions. After a good amount of practice, you learn how to manipulate the other player into placing his units just right, and to minimize the sacrifices that you need to make to freeze things. Barrier the chanty with her catch, and set out a new line. Things start going downhill for them after you've got a handful of units paralyzed.

It isn't easy, and you often lose if the player is good at foresight, but it's a very fun way to play. People often make the mistake of trying to kill them as quickly as possible, but really, they have the advantage in a drawn-out game and the chanty rusher has fewer rescources.

Or, you could just have part of your army kill some of the weaker units before you freeze the leftovers. The trouble with that is when an experienced player starts using their superior units to their advantage which forces you to bring the chanties into play early, creating a situation like the one previously mentioned. That's probably why I liked bringing a good number of chanties out in the first place and working from there, people often get smug about taking an easy win and make quite stupid mistakes.

Of course, I'm only talking about the grey game here. I never figured this out with golds. I have no clue how an enemy's furgon might interrupt it, and I only met with ruin if the enemy had a frost golem or dsm-powered pyros.

[Bottle]

No self-respecting player would make a formation that couldn't hit a chanty SOMEHOW if it froze some units first turn. Even if it has to be a witch shot through some of your own units.

[Noda]

bottle, why would u nescessarily freeze units first turn?

we really dont even need to argue that almost every tactic can be good if the person uses it right witth the proper excecution and pastiance.

if u go to nads thing on enchanties i had posted a huge thing on offensive, which i then defended against nads(i actually think botster added to my argument)

sorry if this thread im talking about is in the SI forums, i dont fully remmeber

[Match Strike]

Offensive chants can work. I've done it and seen it, but never an effective chant "rush." I'd be willing to see someone prove me wrong, but a turtler who uses a pyromancer instead of an enchantress would be tough cookies to beat, and that type of thing is pretty common.

That said, I can see multiple chanties working well with knights as a distraction, but as a rule I don't like drop reliant forms, because when you have to play without drops, your whole style has become dependent on them.

However, I did have quite a bit of fun with a two barrier, two chant turtle, but the enchantresses were in back, like a traditional grey turt.