RGL Round 3: Fixing the problem: Sorry.

[monkus]

I'm not starting Round 3. That would be a sign of incompetence. The RGL isn't working.

Before anything else, congrats on medals:
Geeky_Bastard
bludhoundz
Tyu
x-useme

and points:
Geeky Bastard: 6 points
Bludhoundz: 4 points
Tyu: 4 points
x-useme: 4 points
Monkus: 2 points
The Sniper: 2 points
Forest_Archer: 1 point
Allstar: 1 point
Dave04: 1 point

The RGL has not been functioning correctly. A few statistics:
Fourteen people felt it unnecessary to play any games.
Three played only one game before calling it quits.
Nine were satisfied with only two games.
Four played three games.

Fourteen played more than three games, to whom I am thankful.

So, now, it's time to fix this. The RGL used to be the only serious tournament, which is probably why it was so successful. It will not succeed if I keep it up like this, because so many people have so many obligations.

Everyone who said they want to participate will be considered. I shouldn't have started the sign-up thread without thinking this through. I'll give everyone another chance.

The RGL will make one of four changes:
1. Groups will be much smaller, so people won't be asked to play as many games because they clearly can't handle it.
2. Groups will be demolished and a single league with rankings will replace it. Each person will be asked to play their adjacent opponents. Less time will be offered and less leniency offered.
3. The RGL will continue as is, but reduced to at most half its size. Anyone who doesn't consistently play most of his/her games will be asked to leave.
4. The RGL will be ended entirely.

Make your choice. I'm not going to watch the RGL slowly shrivel away.

[Punishment]

I like choice number 3. If you sign up for RGL, you are saying that you will be able to do your games, and if you are unable to do so, you should be removed from RGL.

[allstarGL]

Definately #3. I like the rgl because I get to be in a group of the best players in tao and get to play them ALL. Thats the biggest draw for me, that there is a bunch of players that i get to play against. It's so easy to get games in because almost everytime you sign on you have an opponent to play at begining. If you made it smaller divisions that would suck or less games.

I really think you should kick anyone out that doesnt play all their games or doesnt have a valid reason for the games they missed. You could also make it so anyone that wants to join up or just people that got kicked out for inactivity have to have a trial month before getting excepted into the league. That way if your inactive you will have to play a whole month of meaningless games to get back in. That would certainly make someone think twice about being inactive.

[x-useme]

It's about time you took a stand Monkus. I told you leniency would only cause laziness.

P.S. Thanks for my medal :)

[Lonely Tylenol]

You know, what I think would be cool is a sort of #2 with a twist--have a single "standings" chart, people play the opponents near them in standings and when they beat somebody they move up accordingly... Basically a miniature rankings chart without outside contributions, people play each other and people beat each other and when they win they're rewarded with a higher standing.

Maybe reward the top 4 of each league round with points and those accumulate over time as people compete for a higher standing.

People who don't play any games over the course of a week are dropped from the league, no questions asked.

[allstarGL]

You know, what I think would be cool is a sort of #2 with a twist--have a single "standings" chart, people play the opponents near them in standings and when they beat somebody they move up accordingly... Basically a miniature rankings chart without outside contributions, people play each other and people beat each other and when they win they're rewarded with a higher standing.

Maybe reward the top 4 of each league round with points and those accumulate over time as people compete for a higher standing.

People who don't play any games over the course of a week are dropped from the league, no questions asked.
You should start a new tourny with that idea. It seems cool but why change this tourny? There is nothing wrong with it. It's simple and fun, just kick out people that don't play and we will be fine.

[speaker4thedead]

Deffinatly wouldnt be able to handle it with less time monkus, In fact for the next month or so i cant handle the internet, got a bag full of exams coming up.

[bludhoundz]

3.

The problem is people signing up and then not fulfilling their duties or not having enough time.

[† Bubacik †]

3!

I like RGL as it is now ... people who didnt play their games, will get a little ban ( can't be in next two RGL rounds :P ).

[Lonely Tylenol]

You should start a new tourny with that idea. It seems cool but why change this tourny? There is nothing wrong with it. It's simple and fun, just kick out people that don't play and we will be fine.

I think the problem with a stoic tourney, however, is even if it's a great tourney people are going to get bored with it. This applies especially to leagues like this one. You have to throw in a twist or something to spice things up or people will just get bored and quit.

[Cuathon]

i agree with LT. For the most part the same people will bounce around in B and A, the tourny needs to be chnaged somehow. now it gives us a chance to play peeps on our level, but its needs something else. also we need a way to get more people in.(not at the same time.) maybe drop people who dont advance in league F and those who drop from D. Its will be very difficult otherwise to bring in new blood. Unless people quit alot which would play havoc with who is in each league.

[Megabyte]

RGL isn't broken, its working like it always has. Even from the get-go when it was first done the major issue was nobody playing their matches. You guys who were around on the orignal attmept should remember that, its why theburning dropped the concept originally. Too much work, and almost nobody did their matches.


I've as of yet to see it really work successfully in all the years its been attempted, and basically because there's no incentive for people to play their matches. Even if someone plays 15 matches a week on average during their own time, its hard (and almost unrealisitc) to expect them to coordinate with others for specific times to do those matches, without any real benefit to themselves (aside from a "medal" or kudos in the first post of a thread ;))


What you need is an official monthly tourney/league like this with a prize, make it a selling point on gold accounts if you want, whatever. You'll never get a consistant and participating group of people to do this without an incentive. Its too much like work otherwise.

[Cuathon]

thats not true mega. there are enough fervent tao lovers to do this, its just a matter of finding them. and reducing group sizes to something like 7. that would have cut aff nearly all of the 14 who played no games this round. a prize would be awesome though. are we going to see the trophies awarded? maybe the A winner gets a trophy and an extra unit spot off field, and b and C get the extra unit spot? well actually that would be a bitch to program. but some sort of prize like having a month(the duration of the league) of gold refunded(though i doubt bills would part with the cash) for the top 3 group leaders and a trophy for A. ugh, any other good prizes i can think of all have problems. without admin support all we could get would be unit prizes which arent really worth much or are unfair(depending on the unit awarded.)

well maybe someone else can think of a good prize besides the trophy. maybe an orange trophy for wining multiple leagues or a hall of fame/record type thing for winners or even the whole league. i might make a list of how every league turns out.(or someone else might, mine wont look very professional, possibly just a thread that is in announcements.

so, whos for at least a hall of fame for the Rev league? and if you are should it getits own page, should we make a tourny page, or forum?
maybe just a sticky?

[Cuathon]

bump

[allstarGL]

RGL isn't broken, its working like it always has. Even from the get-go when it was first done the major issue was nobody playing their matches. You guys who were around on the orignal attmept should remember that, its why theburning dropped the concept originally. Too much work, and almost nobody did their matches.


I've as of yet to see it really work successfully in all the years its been attempted, and basically because there's no incentive for people to play their matches. Even if someone plays 15 matches a week on average during their own time, its hard (and almost unrealisitc) to expect them to coordinate with others for specific times to do those matches, without any real benefit to themselves (aside from a "medal" or kudos in the first post of a thread ;))


What you need is an official monthly tourney/league like this with a prize, make it a selling point on gold accounts if you want, whatever. You'll never get a consistant and participating group of people to do this without an incentive. Its too much like work otherwise.
sooo wrong there. You forget the first one. That was extreamly successful. IT was probably the funnest tourny I;ve ever been in. Everyone in group a played pretty much all their games.

http://www.tacticsarena.com/forum/showthread.php?p=265533#post265533

[I'malive24/7]

I say #3....
I have multiple valid reasons to why i didn't play my games last round! don't hurt me!
On a more serious note, i don't think it should be changed...If you want a totally different way of doing things, make your own tourney.

[Megabyte]

Sorry to bump this after a good week of inactivity, but I thought it worth still discussing, even though you're getting the third round thing going ;)

sooo wrong there. You forget the first one. That was extreamly successful. IT was probably the funnest tourny I;ve ever been in. Everyone in group a played pretty much all their games.


Apparently I'm not the one who forgot :)

THIS was the first RGL, I remember because it was the only one I ever deemed to participate in...
http://www.tacticsarena.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8546


It was slightly more successful than the round you guys just did, but not much. I remmber being annoyed that 2 people basically bailed in my bracket, and nobody actually was able to do ALL of their matches.


As to Cuath...if there are so many fervent TAO lovers, why hasn't the league worked out? If you're needing to find people to do it, maybe I'm missing the point of having the league. I was under the impression the idea was to draw people to you, not have to go out recruiting for it like some clan.

Love of the game has nothing to do with it. Lots of scheduled playing without incentive = more like work and less like gaming. I love TAO, I like to play, but forcing me to schedule up with half a dozen other people (in other time zones and schedules no less) is no easy thing. Plus when you consider the age and reliability of many people here...well, you get the picture.

I still think a more tangible prize would make a GREAT incentive for people, and would go a looong way to making a more active league.

[allstarGL]

Yea im hella NOOB!

[Forest_Archer]

Monk, you've done a great job. Don't get down on yourself. Your efforts on these first two rounds already have been remarkable, with all the tables you made. Thanks for all the fun.

And woot woot! I got a point. . . whatever that means ;)