Alternative to CAU Commitee

[Cuathon]

I have always disliked the CAU commitee. 7 or so people really isnt a good enough veiwpoint(Especially since a new judge is addded only if they have a certified unit.) What i am suggesting is a Review Board(with no offcial status,) elected by common consent.

Members:[That is, people who can vote on Judges.]

Member Requirements:
1. 3 CAU Units
2. 25 CAU Posts

Member Rights:
1. Submit Units
2. Submit Judge Candidates(with 10 signatures from other players)[You can submit yourself as a judge or sign as a secondary to your own petition.]
3. Vote On Judge Candidates[Again you can vote for yourself.]
4. Argue For Units In The Thread(When judges argue about submitted units you can present arguements to support or oppose units certification.)
5. Members May Change Their Votes On Judges

Judges:[That is, people elected by as many members as choose to vote.]

Judge Rights(Judges Also Have All The Rights Of Members):
1. Can Vote To Accept Submitted Units
2. Can Vote To Reject Submitted Units
3. Judge Votes In Judge Tallies Are Worth 2 Normal Votes.
4. New Judges May Vote On Previously Accepted Or Rejected Units
5. Judges May change Their Vote On Any Unit At Any Time


Voting on Units:
Every month if an accepted unit drops below the 2/3 line, or a rejected unit reaches it or goes above it ,(most probably when new judges cast their vote on previously accepted or rejected units, or judges alter their vote,) the unit comes up for review. Judges may then attept to persuade others to change their votes. They have 3 days to do so, then the unit's status reflects its new vote tally.

Voting on Judges:
Every month judges come up for review. At months end any Judge is either retained or removed form the Judge list depending on their vote tally.
Similarly Judge Candidates are added or rejected every month. Rejected Candidates have their tallies on a special list. If their total is above the line at months end, they are added to the panel and a PM is sent to tell them.


NOTE: Everyone should suggest rules they think are important or give reasons why some laws should be removed or altered.(Im not sure who makes the final desicion yet: Me, the Judges, or Everyone.)

Suggestions:
1. 10, 20, or 30 Member Votes equal to one Judge Vote(in unit tallies.)

now i realize that this is complicated and not really required, but it might be interesting. also it more representative than the CAU Commitee.

One should again not that this is not official and never will be.

any suggestions are welcome.

also this is just a suggestion. if people wish to have a representative commitee any and all rules can be re-written.

[Ciompi]

I think the first committee made sense in some ways but was flawed in others. I think the purpose needs to be served and it's dead as it is so I would support a new one.

Come to think of it, both could exist at the same time.

[uniquinous]

sorry to be the pessimistic one, but it just seems like you are making another arbitrary panel for arbitrary decision making...

[Ciompi]

Eh, no decision any committee makes equals rock hard truth but these things do at least have potential to encourage better CAU work. This way would be more democratic, for better or for worse.

[Cuathon]

indeed i am uni. also one that would be very difficult to regualte and take a lot of time to run. thats why im always stresing that it doesn mean anything. i'd be happier if it could be run at the same time as the CAUC.

the goal isnt to determine which units are awsome adn which suck, but which people think have the best concept and execution.

i also understand that this is more republican than democratic. but true democracy would never work.

[shatterstar]

the thing i like about your idea is that a unit can be submitted by anyone. i never submitted to the old committee but it sounded a lot like berating a judge into liking your unit just to have it considered.



The vote is kept continously. A candidate is submitted when another player posts with the name and with 10 secondaries. every member has one vote on each candidate. as new people meet the requirements they create a vote post. where they vote on the candidates and current judges. any player who has 2/3 of the votes as positive is a member. the main thread will have the second post reserved to record votes. if a member of CAU who is a judge stays below 2/3 of the vote for one week is removed. if their vote then goes above and stays so for three days they are re-added.


on this...hmm..i would suggest make it a weekly or every-3-days update on votes on members. so judges who drop below the 2/3 mark at the end of 1 week have till the end of the next week to get it back up. that will increase stability, reduce bitching and reduce work for the vote counter.

also:


each person who has made at least one CAU unit and 15 posts in CAU has a vote.


this has to be 1 'proper' unit and 15 posts with a minumum degree of contribution to the discussion. someone who says 'good unit' to ever posted unit in CAU and makes a 'HP:100 attack:50 attacks everyone around it what do yuo think??' unit shouldnt have that counted. i know it sounds harsh but it will increase serious CAU contribution, whcih i think, should be the end-result of any such move.

[Serge]

My idea for the alternative to the CAU committee, which I mentioned in that thread, but never started. My idea was for a monthly/bi-monthly thread. A thread that me, and maybe a few other people, could make. Sort of like a newspaper, that talked about the most interesting ideas that month/2 week period, and maybe a vintage section. And then the masses could moan with our comments, or cheer in our pointless speculation.

[shatterstar]

My idea for the alternative to the CAU committee, which I mentioned in that thread, but never started. My idea was for a monthly/bi-monthly thread. A thread that me, and maybe a few other people, could make. Sort of like a newspaper, that talked about the most interesting ideas that month/2 week period, and maybe a vintage section. And then the masses could moan with our comments, or cheer in our pointless speculation.


i'm more than willing to work with you on that if you want. both these ideas can exist at the same time. in fact, such a newpaper would help gather enough reposnes on reviewed units to have the author consider sending it to Cuathon's Board. also most of the discussions in the thread are stat-related, this would be good way to get more tactical analysis in. gr8 ideas all round.

[uniquinous]

and what, in your opinion, is the point, exactly?

Say we somehow manage to organize a theoretically perfect list of the best to worst units made...

then what? What is the point? Give the pions something to do? Really I just don't get it...

[Jeffery]

Well Uni, what is the point of the CAU itself?

As pointless as it is, the committee was formed so that some members could feelk how much better they were than others. Since people realised the CAU is completely useless in TAO, the took it upon themselves to try and give themselves an ego boost by making someone, even if it was just themselves, pay attention to them.

But, the committee failed miserably because TAOers are a bunch of lazy snots that can;t focus on something more than a couple weeks at a time.

So now the newest way to stroke themselves has been suggested. Gee, lets rank the units in order of badness, so that my sucky idea looks better next to the next sucky idea.

[Hellblazer]

I see no point of making yet another CAU commitee. This'll eventually turn into the same thing that the already-existing CAU commitee does.
The first thread, that has been stickied, was fine. Sure, let people have their dreams. This one, however, makes it pretty clear that it's just to boost the morale(sp?) of CAU.
Final point: there will always be noobs that wish to spam in CAU. This won't stop that in any way because it's pointless. If the first Commitee thread didn't get any actual units made in the game, what makes you think this one will? And since it's not going to get any units made, then it's just another poll thread.

[Cuathon]

lol Jeff. that is indeed true. CAU is pointless beyong being something to do. Just like TAO in fact. :)

shatter? who is to judge whether a unit is proper? if we do that what would be the conditions of proper? you'll note that that is only to be eligible. they still have to be elected.

lol Hell, who said anything about stopping spam? also you shoulkd say did, since currently the CAUC doesnt do anything :)

[Hellblazer]

lol Hell, who said anything about stopping spam? also you shoulkd say did, since currently the CAUC doesnt do anything :)
I got the notion this was so better-quality units would be produced due to the morale-boosting this thread would spread. That would mean less spam units, if the theory works.
And, yes, the CAUC does not do anything anymore.....Oh well.

[Walrus]

seems like an interesting idea, i like the fact that it is a bit more "free for all" than the old committee in that anyone can submit units and there is a lot more freedom for who can become...well....stuff.
seems worth a shot if it can be organised for sure, perhaphs a little more clarification on exactly how it works ;)

[Cuathon]

people often do better or like things betterif its possible to get recognition. thats the purpose. if you consider that every game in existence and some things like CAU have sore-borad, or some other recognition it makes sense.

whats interesting to note is that i might not even be on this commitee when its made :)

walrus, anyone could submit units to the old commitee.

which part confuses you? i'll try to explain.

[Walrus]

ive woken up a bit more now, i understand it i think.

one thing is, would there be a minimum amount of total votes needed for a person to be on the review board?
and would there be any other requirements to actually being on the board, such as having made a certain amount of units or whatever?

[Deck of Jesters]

This idea cannot work. Not because it doesn't work in theory, rather, because it doesn't work in practice. There are too many people who post (-cough-duckydoo-cough-) that can't tell the difference between a perfect unit and their own garbage. By giving power to the masses, you are allowing a torent of useless and mindless opinions to be given on units that are, at best, weakly strung out. The odds of your commitee passing units that are, to say, pathetic is too great. However, much like Jeffery has said, CAU is pointless, much like the rest of these forums... and the internet... and the computer.

[Cuathon]

ah you misunderstand, the masses only have the power to elect judges. it would take a consortium of n00bs to get a n00b judge on the board or even submitted as a candidate. the n00bs would have to make a concerted effort and thye'd have to have more votes than the non-n00bs. i doubt they are capable of getting elected.

[shatterstar]

thats exactly what I was trying to get across in my point about 'proper' units.

I meant that THIS (http://tacticsarena.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25846&highlight=angel+queen)shouldnt qualify as a unit that gets you voting rights. I understand thats its a very very sticky issue but I'd rather not see the next ducky come along and say, 'i made a unit now can i vote?'.

uniq, the point of this, is not to get a unit made or even feel important or even rank units. for me, the point would be to get more serious interest in CAU and get the ppl who come here a lot and ever read this section interested. the only recent good units that come to mind (other than mine ;) ) were DoJ's impeding growth and Alaric's Desert Twins and maybe FD's Rambeast. By giving some incentive for good units, either through getting a review from Cua'a board or a spot in Serge's newspaper, would hopefully increase the frquency of units of that level.

edit: on 2nd thought im starting to see the difficulty in deciding if a unit qualifies or not. i'd be keen on seeing some way of implementing it but dont see how....

[Ciompi]

By giving power to the masses, you are allowing a torent of useless and mindless opinions to be given on units that are, at best, weakly strung out.
I think this is why the first committee wasn't a democracy, it was a self-appointed monarchy. The self-appointed kings of CAU thing always got to me a bit (though I must admit they responded to those objections in the early days of the committee) but at least it remained respectable for a while. I personally think most of the certified units are good units, with the exception of some of the later ones, which got certified after a lot of the really good judges left. So this idea risks having bad units get through.

HOWEVER: having a unit not certified for eternity does solve this problem, slightly. If a mistake is made, at least then it can be fixed if smarter people show up later on.

I disagree with most of Jeffery's post but the point about people being lazy snots that can't focus on something for a long time is a strong one. Look at the first committee. Look what has happened to it. Why won't it happen to this one?

I think these things should be taken into consideration and then I think someone should give it a shot. If Cuathon doesn't want to start it up, I personally think he should be the one to choose the person to start it up, as it's his idea.

[Cuathon]

well, assuming i get voted in, i'll prob make the thread and update the lists and such. i might even do that if im not a judge.

i must point out though, that dukies vote would only be valueble if not a lot of people vote. or if it was borderline decision. you guys must remember that only judges can vote on units. all normal players can do is submit judge candidates, submit units, and vote on judges. they will have no say in unit voting. this system is more republican than democratic. it could be changed so that people could vote on units, or maybe 10 normal people could be worth one judge vote(or some such thing.)

Main Post Edited.

[Cuathon]

are we gonna attempt this? or is it too complicated to be worth it?

[Walrus]

dont ask me, im drunk :cool:

[Cross Punisher]

So it's just like the old one except everyone who wants to votes on who a judge is?

[The Coder]

Sniff... I wouldn't be a member... I only created 2 units...

Edit - Eh, I finished my recent one. Im not sure I balanced it right, but eh...

[Cuathon]

its a(sorta) republican-type commitee.

other differences include not permanent judges and certifications.

you cant really be that much different and still achieve anything. democracy would be ridiculous.(just as in real life.)

if enough wish to participate, nominations will begin tomorrow, otherwise it will go into the abyss of CAU.

[shatterstar]

i'm ready to go ahead with this committee thing if we can generate some interest. i dont want to stand right now as i dont have the time ot sit and read lotsa units, but if any1 needs a seconder to become a judge, PM and if i know you or yr units i'll happily second you.

[Serge]

I don't really like this idea, but as for which units get you qualification to vote, I'd say anything that had all the stats, and had at least 2-3 sentences describing how it would be used in battle.