Finish it. [Archive] - Tactics Arena Community Forums

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 09:50 AM

Are you saying all that crap just because I said "that's gay,"? :dry:

Edit: wow uniqu... CALM DOWN. Just read your neg. The only reason I put that in there was jokingly. I'm not try to insult people who are gay. I (and apparently manti33) thought it looked/sounded funny. I'm not homophobic as you claimed me to be in your neg. Of course, the way you got so defensive over such a petty and minute "insult" leads me to question your own sexuality... ;)
yeah pretty much. You continue to show your immaturity with phrases like "question your own sexuality". Does it actually matter? Honestly? No, the fact that you need to question anything just shows your own stupidity.

I try to remain a genderless, asexual persona on these boards for a reason - hoping I will be seen and defined as a PERSON, not by some superficial crap of gender or sexuality. So you say you used the term "gay" as a joke. Do tell: why do you and mantis think it looks/sounds funny? There's nothing inherently comical about the word. No, you found it funny because you're making fun of a minority sexuality. Is being gay actually funny to you? Are you REALLY that childish? Does "straight" seem funny to you? "Oh man that class sucked it was totally straight". Notice how DUMB that sounds?

Grow some balls and take responsibility for your ignorant stupidity. In the earlier 1900s people would similarly attack black culture, cuz it was "funny". You gonna acuse me of being black now like you accused me of being gay? Or have you figured out that I'm simply standing up for basic human equality free of harmful prejudiced remarks?

Make no mistake - I'm not flipping out about this - I'm actually very calm right now - but I WILL continue to call you out on stupidity rather harshly. This world has enough prejudice in it already. Time to grow up.

~Rod R~

09-25-2006, 10:45 AM

I AM offended...n00b

EatMine

09-25-2006, 11:46 AM

I try to remain a genderless, asexual persona on these boards for a reason - hoping I will be seen and defined as a PERSON, not by some superficial crap of gender or sexuality.LOL.
If you really think gender and sexuality is superficial crap, i suggest consulting a psychiatrist immediately, cause it can't get any more natural at all ...
This is basic humanity, even on an internet forum. Denying this is superficial, if not pathological.

Grow some balls...double standards, huh ;)

In the earlier 1900s people would similarly attack black cultureLame. That's two totally different things.

Or have you figured out that I'm simply standing up for basic human equality free of harmful prejudiced remarks?And where exactly was Tama's statement harmful?
By the way: if you talk about basic human equality, this includes jokes too! When gay people can make jokes about straight people, they should be able to take some dick jokes too without being offended.

You really should relax and start feeling comfortable with your penis!
Or in case this is the weenyless version of you: don't be a hater! You know, us males love you the way you are, no need for penis envy ...

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 12:03 PM

LOL.
If you really think gender and sexuality is superficial crap, i suggest consulting a psychiatrist immediately, cause it can't get any more natural at all ...
This is basic humanity, even on an internet forum. Denying this is superficial, if not pathological.First and foremost: nice siggy, and... ewy. Next: no way - people judge each other on the internet all the time based on preconcieved notions of gender roles in this society. Wizzy has shown many times that girls are treated much more differently then boys in this community. Why? Denying gender and sexuality in real life situations is indeed unhealthy, as you suggest, but allowing it to rule our behavior in an online environment where such things *dont matter* is also unhealthy. That doesn't mean it's unnatural, it doesn't mean it's any less then basic humanity, it just means it SHOULD NOT have a role in determining how one anonymous intarweb name interacts with another anonymous intarweb name.

double standards, huh ;) Actually this line was a joke I was making (using an insecure sense of "manliness" against him) - was hoping someone would pick up on it. :)

Lame. That's two totally different things.Why? Little social and political jokes were made all the time which associated negative human traits to black people. Similarly, immature kids in this society associate negative human traits and experiences as "gay". It's the classic under-the-breath indirect jab at a minority.

And where exactly was Tama's statement harmful?
By the way: if you talk about basic human equality, this includes jokes too! When gay people can make jokes about straight people, they should be able to take some dick jokes too without being offended.Truth, jokes are one thing. In fact, I make a ton of gay jokes (or to be more precise, jokes which mock people who use terms like "gay" in replace of "suck" - hmm I suppose that's one right there....). But I'm sure you can clearly differentiate the difference between a joke made in good fun, and the continued use of a social identifier in a derogatory way. It's one thing to say "a gay guy walked into a bar..." and something completely different when saying "this crap is so gay".

EatMine

09-25-2006, 12:23 PM

You really do have problems with penises, right?
You can't even quote my "anonymous intarweb name" without being offended :rolleyes:

Honey, if you just can't swallow your pride, i give you the one-time opportunity now to spit it all out, what's bugging you.
Please, feel free to tell me whatever burdens your heart. I promise i'll listen carefully and won't come back with some immature jokes.

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 12:46 PM

i'm not offended by eatmine - i was simply expanding on it. :)

really, nothing's wrong - i just don't like people flinging terms like gay, queer, or any other minotiry identifier around like they were garbage. I like wit. I like humor. I don't like ignorance (and it is really running rampant in today's youth).

Lord Sesshomaru

09-25-2006, 12:57 PM

I dont mind making jokes about minorities or cultures. Its no fun if you cant laugh at yourself. But i do agree about what uni said about using gay or fag as an insult in substitution with sucks. But jokes are cool. Though im Swedish so i dont know any jokes that can be made at my expense. Though anyone is willing to try. I could use a good laugh.

Drunk With Hate

09-25-2006, 01:53 PM

No, the fact that you need to question anything just shows your own stupidity.
"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing." - Socrates

I try to remain a genderless, asexual persona on these boards for a reason - hoping I will be seen and defined as a PERSON, not by some superficial crap of gender or sexuality.
ROFL -> Followed with this quote.

Grow some balls yada yada yada.
Amazing how someone who is trying to remain genderless in effort to define people as people and not by gender then goes and tells someone to grow some balls, something strickly gender related.

Uniq. I am going to point out, now, why half of TAO hates you.

You're a dick. Not only that but you jump on people for little things. The term "gay" is very colloquially understood as just something bad. The thing is though, that is slang. By definition, it means something very good ("merry"). The author's definition of a word is more important than the way you want to define it. He wasn't trying to link a negative connotation of homosexuality to the situation at hand. He was using a word that colloquially means bad to compare to a bad situation. Nothing more, nothing less. Now, if his post was filled with anti-homosexual propaganda and stupidity, then you would have a reason to rant. You don't though. Right now, you only have a reason to stfu.

Lord Sesshomaru

09-25-2006, 02:05 PM

Rep: What are beautiful women in Sweden called? Tourists!

HAHAHA! Keep em coming guys.

Tama Drummer

09-25-2006, 02:36 PM

Make no mistake - I'm not flipping out about this - I'm actually very calm right now - but I WILL continue to call you out on stupidity rather harshly. This world has enough prejudice in it already. Time to grow up.

No, no... you're DEFINATELY overreacting. :rolleyes:

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 04:40 PM

meh overreacting and flipping out are two different things tho.

ah dirka - you've made yet another name because the entirety of TAO telling you to go away seems to be ineffective. And yet, you claim half of TAO hates me? lol. I think it's safe to say, even while I am chewing out Tama here, we both hold quite a bit of respect for the other person, and neither of us actually hates the other. Of course, idiots such as yourself, dirka, wouldn't actually know what a standard of human interaction is - you can only base your "insight" on your own experience: people arguing with you that actually do hate you.

As I mentioned previously, the term "grow some balls" was a joke. It's inherently contradictory with EVERYTHING I said. You... seemed to have not only missed that, but also missed the fact that I pointed it out as a joke. :rolleyes:

The term "gay" is very colloquially understood as just something bad. The thing is though, that is slang.The term "nigger" was very colloquially understood as something bad, back in the day. The thing is though, that is slang. :dry:

OK so it's clear I can use your own ill-founded words against you. You've clearly shown your ability to quote wise men and use big words, but you still are unable to grasp the greater lessons from those teachings and incorporate them into a stable or wise mindset of your own. You are a pale shadow, despite all your pathetic efforts, and I find that very entertaining.

This society has no reason to uphold the use of such slang, as it IS demeaning to the gay community. Next time you attend any type of gay-friendly meetings/organizations, ask around and find out for yourself. Just because you don't see the harm it causes because it doesn't affect you does NOT mean it is harmless. Assuming such is ignorant.

.MinD.

09-25-2006, 05:14 PM

Grow some balls and take responsibility for your ignorant stupidity. In the earlier 1900s people would similarly attack black culture, cuz it was "funny". You gonna acuse me of being black now like you accused me of being gay? Or have you figured out that I'm simply standing up for basic human equality free of harmful prejudiced remarks?

Blacks and gay people are two completely different things. You are born black, and nothing you do will change that. As for gay, it is a choice people make along the way, mostly for attention. People aren't born gay, people are born black.

speaker4thedead

09-25-2006, 05:31 PM

#### happens :D

But while im here...

Fags in england mean something differnt then in america i was in a game when I was talking about smoking and said fag and got kicked, anyway was only clan game
[/my intresting game] :)

The Ultimater

09-25-2006, 05:34 PM

Blacks and gay people are two completely different things. You are born black, and nothing you do will change that. As for gay, it is a choice people make along the way, mostly for attention. People aren't born gay, people are born black.

Michael Jackson could change that. he became white, from black.wow that is just so amazing isn't it guys? :rolleyes:

Jeffery

09-25-2006, 05:55 PM

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 05:57 PM

Blacks and gay people are two completely different things. You are born black, and nothing you do will change that. As for gay, it is a choice people make along the way, mostly for attention. People aren't born gay, people are born black.you.... you're joking, right? You're not actually that completely moronic, right? Please, tell me some scrap of decency exists still and that I still have some tiny hope for humanity - that that little quote wasn't so ignorant I don't know whether to wish physical harm upon you or pity you with bittersweet giggles. PLEASE TELL ME YOU'RE NOT THAT DUMB!
(altho I have to say, I especially like the "being gay is something you can catch" lines) :rolleyes:

oh for the record - people aren't born straight either ;)

#### happens :D

But while im here...

Fags in england mean something differnt then in america i was in a game when I was talking about smoking and said fag and got kicked, anyway was only clan game
[/my intresting game] :)yeah i knew fags in england meant something different. i can't think of the word now, but it means something long and round you put your lips around and suck... i would argue I'm not a hypocrit, but I'm too tired

Drunk With Hate

09-25-2006, 06:25 PM

ah dirka - you've made yet another name because the entirety of TAO telling you to go away seems to be ineffective. yada yada yada, i like to type
No, no. That's not why. If you had eyes, you'd know why.

As I mentioned previously, the term "grow some balls" was a joke.
Call it a joke, call it whatever. He claimed his first use of "gay" was a joke. That isn't good enough. When trying to make a point against someone "joking" you shouldn't yourself joke.

The term "nigger" was very colloquially understood as something bad, back in the day. The thing is though, that is slang. :dry:
The tern "nigger" still means something bad. Although depending on who says it and where.

This society has no reason to uphold the use of such slang, as it IS demeaning to the gay community. Next time you attend any type of gay-friendly meetings/organizations, ask around and find out for yourself. Just because you don't see the harm it causes because it doesn't affect you does NOT mean it is harmless. Assuming such is ignorant.
Right, here is the thing. You say it is connected to homosexuality. I say its a parody of the word meaning "merry." I could say the word white offends me because it's colorless. Just because it offends a certain group doesn't mean it shouldn't be used. Saying it shouldn't, is ignorant.

Blacks and gay people are two completely different things. You are born black, and nothing you do will change that. As for gay, it is a choice people make along the way, mostly for attention. People aren't born gay, people are born black.
You are an idiot.

.MinD.

09-25-2006, 08:26 PM

Too bad even science has proven your bigotry wrong.

I don't think so, Jeffery. Show me undeniable evidence that I am wrong. There is no way to test this, and I'm not wrong. Everything you do is a choice, including that lisp that all gay people thing is necessary. that is also a choice. When you turn gay, you don't magically grow a lisp.

Love is an emotion, not a gender

Yes, love is an emotion. So is happiness, sadness, anger, etc. You choose to be happy and sad. Outside factors influence this, sure, but it is YOUR CHOICE all together.

EatMine

09-25-2006, 08:36 PM

Phew, good that you posted again. I'm thinking for an hour now how to reply to your statement.

Yes, it's true. You can't be scientifically proven wrong - at least as far as i know - but nonetheless: your wording was terrible. It is antisocial and it implies the risk of supporting religious fanatics or nazis.
This topic is too complex, to make such general statements.

Tama Drummer

09-25-2006, 08:37 PM

Lol, why not. Noone cares about the orriginal topic anymore, now that the topic's been drastically changed.

http://www.thetruthforyouth.com/NEW%20Comics/bw/pages/BTW_1.htm

EatMine

09-25-2006, 09:06 PM

:rolleyes: Why don't you read some of your Drummer magazines (http://www.creativevisionsbooks.com/camagadru00000001na.html) and let the adults handle this?

Drunk With Hate

09-25-2006, 09:21 PM

I don't think so, Jeffery. Show me undeniable evidence that I am wrong. There is no way to test this, and I'm not wrong. Everything you do is a choice, including that lisp that all gay people thing is necessary. that is also a choice. When you turn gay, you don't magically grow a lisp.

Not all gay people have a lisp. That is because alot of gay people are from the same area, and the way that area talks sounds like that. I forgot the area. Someone else should know what I'm talking about.

The Coder

09-25-2006, 09:51 PM

The thing is, people can say cu.nt but you cant say sh.it

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 10:14 PM

listen coder - you have my respect, but putting a . in the middle of the word doesn't in any way change what the word is you just said :p

No, no. That's not why. If you had eyes, you'd know why.Actually you said that very thing last time, and when asked, you refused to answer, stating it was clearly obvious, despite the fact that no one knew, there WAS no decent reason, and you could not in any way provide one. Lemme guess, you will STILL refuse to actually provide a reason why you don't just use any of your other previously made accounts, retreating back to such childish wordiness as "if you can't see how obvious it is I won't tell you". :rolleyes:. OK driak - tell us: why did you create yet another name?
Call it a joke, call it whatever. He claimed his first use of "gay" was a joke. That isn't good enough. When trying to make a point against someone "joking" you shouldn't yourself joke.Except, his use of that term was referring to his disdain for swear filter. Mine was a very clear irony which others such as EatMine very clearly were able to pick out.

The tern "nigger" still means something bad. Although depending on who says it and where.Similarly, "gay" still means something bad. Although dependong on who says it and where. :rolleyes: It's so easy to use your own words to completely reduce your point to garbage. Both "nigger" and "gay" are two derogatory words for a minority group when used inapropriately, especially (but not always the case) in the hands of the majority.

Right, here is the thing. You say it is connected to homosexuality. I say its a parody of the word meaning "merry." I could say the word white offends me because it's colorless. Just because it offends a certain group doesn't mean it shouldn't be used. Saying it shouldn't, is ignorant.And this makes you an idiot. Why is it ignorant? No, it's not that I'm saying "this term offends people", I'm saying "this term which directly identifies a group of people is being abused, and THAT ignorance should not be tolerated in this society". If you really think he was using the term "gay" from the meaning "merry", I'm actually amazed how strongly you just allowed your stupidity to manifest itself. I don't even think Tama Drummer will admit that his intended meaning from that word originated from merry. It's abundantly clear it's origins came from homosexuality, much like many other insults in today's culture come from similar terms: queer, carpet-muncher, pillow-biter, homo, gay. (i find it interesting that I laugh even as I make that serious point...)

Show me undeniable evidence that I am wrongShow me ANY evidence that you are right! Everything you do is a choice, eh? So if Jeffery comes to your house and murders your family, when you begin crying he can just tell you "stop feeling sad, it's only a choice." Oh I got one! It's just a CHOICE that people like eating meat and vegetables instead of dirt. LOVE is a choice. WHO you love is not - it's an unrestricted emotion. You can choose NOT to love someone, but you can't actively choose to love them, it just kinda comes on its own.

So tell me, MIND, if being gay is just a choice, does that mean, if you chose to, you could just start finding other men really attractive? I mean, heck, it's just a choice... like deciding whether you want an apple or a banana. It doesn't matter, right? Just a choice :rolleyes:

Drunk With Hate

09-25-2006, 10:42 PM

Actually you said that very thing last time, and when asked, you refused to answer, stating it was clearly obvious, despite the fact that no one knew, there WAS no decent reason, and you could not in any way provide one. Lemme guess, you will STILL refuse to actually provide a reason why you don't just use any of your other previously made accounts, retreating back to such childish wordiness as "if you can't see how obvious it is I won't tell you". :rolleyes:. OK driak - tell us: why did you create yet another name?
ROFL. Uniq. Look at my old names. Find a common reason I can't use those names. It's simple.

Except, his use of that term was referring to his disdain for swear filter. Mine was a very clear irony which others such as EatMine very clearly were able to pick out.
...and BOTH were the exact same type of literature. Parody.

Similarly, "gay" still means something bad. Although dependong on who says it and where. :rolleyes: It's so easy to use your own words to completely reduce your point to garbage. Both "nigger" and "gay" are two derogatory words for a minority group when used inapropriately, especially (but not always the case) in the hands of the majority.
That's the point!! The word gay, in itself, isn't bad! Just as the word nigger, in itself, isn't bad.

I'm saying "this term which directly identifies a group of people is being abused, and THAT ignorance should not be tolerated in this society".
The term gay does not identify a group of people. When I think gay, I don't think homosexual. Gay -> Bad. Homosexual -> sexuality. If anything, you're linking the term gay, which in tama's case meant a bad thing, to homosexuality, and you are the one that is insulting homosexuality.

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 11:12 PM

ROFL. Uniq. Look at my old names. Find a common reason I can't use those names. It's simpleInteresting! All banned. And the original reason I stated which for some reason you refuted:
ah dirka - you've made yet another name because the entirety of TAO telling you to go away seems to be ineffectiveSorry, I should have been more clear, it's not everyone, just mostly everyone, lead strongly by the mods. :rolleyes:

...and BOTH were the exact same type of literature. Parody.And yet, the connotation is completely different. One is laughing at a group, one with a group. I know, I need to resort to 3rd grade homeroom lessons with you sometimes. Boiling things down till they are simplistic enough to share something in common does NOT mean that the original complexity is the same. Calling something gay in a derogatory manner is not the same as going against the very point being made to state "grow some balls". But... you clearly can't quite see that. Again, this is a perfect example of you reading all the books, learning all the big words, and yet still not having any of the answers or logic for yourself.

That's the point!! The word gay, in itself, isn't bad! Just as the word nigger, in itself, isn't bad.Actually few words are inherently bad. However, this is why the English language has the word "connotation". Look it up, if you need help, but using words that are not inherently bad for derogatory purposes MAKES them bad. It's how you USE it (seriously, someone better make a joke about that one...).

The term gay does not identify a group of people. When I think gay, I don't think homosexual. Gay -> Bad. Homosexual -> sexuality. If anything, you're linking the term gay, which in tama's case meant a bad thing, to homosexuality, and you are the one that is insulting homosexuality.You don't link gay with homosexual? This either makes you a caveman, or a moron. To be honest I haven't figured out which you actually are.

So when you hear "gay pride" you think it means "bad pride"? oh and "gay rights" really means "bad rights"? :huh: lolz0r and a half! You're right, I must be the only one linking gay with homosexual in this society. :rolleyes:

wait wait wait i got one. When Michael Jackson sang:
"You Know I'm Bad, I'm Bad, You Know It (Bad Bad-Really, Really Bad)
Just To Tell You Once Again, Who's Bad . . ."
He was really saying:
"You know I'm gay, I'm gay, You know It (Gay Gay-Really, Really Gay)
Just to Tell you Once again, Who's gay"

ah the world through crap colored glasses, a la dirk. you would have made a good sophist

Drunk With Hate

09-25-2006, 11:27 PM

Interesting! All banned. And the original reason I stated which for some reason you refuted:
Sorry, I should have been more clear, it's not everyone, just mostly everyone, lead strongly by the mods. :rolleyes:
Actually, it is one person, whom really doesn't care.

Yada Yada Yada
Honestly, I don't care. You insult him for using parody and then use it yourself. I don't care how you justify it, as a joke, as a damned puppy for all I care. It is what it is.

It's how you USE it.
That's right! It's how you use it. So since he didn't use it in any connection to homosexuality, then it has no connection to homosexuality.

You don't link gay with homosexual? This either makes you a caveman, or a moron. To be honest I haven't figured out which you actually are.
"That's gay." <- No, no link. "I saw a gay man." <- Link.

So when you hear "gay pride" you think it means "bad pride"? oh and "gay rights" really means "bad rights"? :huh: lolz0r and a half! You're right, I must be the only one linking gay with homosexual in this society. :rolleyes:
See above. It depends on how it is used. Just like you said 2 quotes up.

uniquinous

09-25-2006, 11:35 PM

Actually, it is one person, whom really doesn't care.Clearly someone cares if they take all 2 seconds to banz0r - stop fooling yourself :rolleyes:

Honestly, I don't care. You insult him for using parody and then use it yourself. I don't care how you justify it, as a joke, as a damned puppy for all I care. It is what it is.mmm the classic put-my-fingers-in-my-ears-and-hum-loudly technique. Yes, good way to back your claim. I'll restate mine for the heck of it: not all paradies are the same. Reducing them down to the most simplistic of literary terms and calling them identical is foolish.

"That's gay." <- No, no link. "I saw a gay man." <- Link.So what about this: "I saw a man. He was gay" Link or no link? Really are you going to continue trying to prove this inane point? I expect more from you.

Drunk With Hate

09-25-2006, 11:53 PM

Clearly someone cares if they take all 2 seconds to banz0r - stop fooling yourself :rolleyes:
... No, he really doesn't care, considering I talk to him almost every day. One of the names I asked him to ban. The others, were for "hacking." lol

mmm the classic put-my-fingers-in-my-ears-and-hum-loudly technique. Yes, good way to back your claim. I'll restate mine for the heck of it: not all paradies are the same. Reducing them down to the most simplistic of literary terms and calling them identical is foolish.
All parodies are parodies. Doesn't matter to me how simple of a term that is. If you want to insult someone for using a parody, don't use one yourself. Hell, even both were joking, playing with words with a "hidden meaning."

So what about this: "I saw a man. He was gay" Link or no link? Really are you going to continue trying to prove this inane point? I expect more from you.
It is fairly simple. If you call an object gay, it obviously has NO connection to homosexuality. If you call a person gay, then it has an obvious connection to homosexuality. Now there are exceptions, but 99% of the time what is meant is very obvious.

~X-Doomsday~

09-25-2006, 11:58 PM

Edit: This reaplie is for Uniq's last paragraph

In that case i would take it as neither. You have to also hear how they say it, if they make it as a point to him being gay like dude that guy was gay and make a face or jester to it or just saying hmm that guy was gay and walking on.

Zander

09-26-2006, 12:10 AM

Blacks and gay people are two completely different things. You are born black, and nothing you do will change that. As for gay, it is a choice people make along the way, mostly for attention. People aren't born gay, people are born black.

you've established yourself as the new forums dumbass, you're done talking.

i just wanted to come to this thread to tell you to say "fimish him/her"(mortal kombat) instead,it'd jumped into my head and i figured why not, and the first thing i see when i open up this thread was "blacks and gay people"

.MinD.

09-26-2006, 12:17 AM

you've established yourself as the new forums dumbass, you're done talking.

i just wanted to come to this thread to tell you to say "fimish him/her"(mortal kombat) instead,it'd jumped into my head and i figured why not, and the first thing i see when i open up this thread was "blacks and gay people"

Excuse me, Zander?

You're the dumbass, my friend.

I'm not wrong. There is ABSOLUTELY NO PROOF that you are born gay. I'm not done talking. I happen to be very anti-gay. You see blacks and gay people because uniquinous always find a way to bring a homosexual discussion to any thread where the word Gay is used.

As I said before, I'm NOT WRONG. Just because I disagree with you and everyone here (Probably all quite liberal) doesn't make me a dumbass. It means I have my own opinions. And Zander, for this, all i have to say to you is "Fuck You"

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 06:02 AM

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 06:03 AM

Excuse me, Zander?

You're the dumbass, my friend.

I'm not wrong. There is ABSOLUTELY NO PROOF that you are born gay. I'm not done talking. I happen to be very anti-gay. You see blacks and gay people because uniquinous always find a way to bring a homosexual discussion to any thread where the word Gay is used.

As I said before, I'm NOT WRONG. Just because I disagree with you and everyone here (Probably all quite liberal) doesn't make me a dumbass. It means I have my own opinions. And Zander, for this, all i have to say to you is "Fuck You"

There is no proof you are born with a sexual preference at all! That DOESN'T matter and doesn't make it choice. Is going to school choice? Is your ego choice? Is how you feel about yourself, choice? Is who you like, choice?

EatMine

09-26-2006, 06:11 AM

.Mind., stop bringing skin color into this. Like you say yourself, it has nothing to do with it. So repeating it only makes you look like a dumb racist.

And yes, uniquinous pushes it too hard, but if i had to choose between overdone political correct posts and uneducated ignorance, i'd go with the first one any day.

In regards to the gay discussion: Just because people might not be born gay, doesn't make them any lesser gay. So, why don't you state your reasons for being anti-gay, and then we'll see whether you're a dumbass or not.

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 08:34 AM

meh, taking a firm stand on topics such as this for educational purposes on the board is quite different then how I joke with friends who can clearly tell I'm being ironic in jest. Besides, it flushes out all the noobs :) (really, I'm still of the belief that the absolute worst insult that can be said to a teenager today is that they are 'homojewtarded') :p

back to the point:All parodies are parodies. Doesn't matter to me how simple of a term that is. If you want to insult someone for using a parody, don't use one yourself. Hell, even both were joking, playing with words with a "hidden meaning."All parodies are parodies, eh? My! How did you acquire such wisdom! And yet, you still lack the clarity to see that, even tho a parady is a parady, not all parodies are the same. Until you can acknowledge that, do shut up.

It is fairly simple. If you call an object gay, it obviously has NO connection to homosexuality. If you call a person gay, then it has an obvious connection to homosexuality. Now there are exceptions, but 99% of the time what is meant is very obvious.ah i see, it only means "crap" in regards to inatimate objects :rolleyes: Can you perhaps give me a single other example of a word that means one thing when referring to objects and something completely different when referring to people?

Surely, in all your stupidity, you realize the etymology of the word. Actually I found urbandictionary entries the most amusing, but the one that serves my purpose is:1. gay
1. jovial or happy, good-spirited
2. a homosexual male or female
3. often used to describe something stupid or unfortunate. originating from homophobia. quite preferable among many teenage males in order to buff up their "masculinity"
followed in close second by this wonderful definition with the word used in a sentence:
3. gay
1. Happy.
2. Homosexual.
3. A generic insult.
Used in a sentence for each definition:
1. You are gay.
2. You are gay.
3. You are gay.Now I'm sure you can say UD isn't the best source to use, but let's not fool ourselves on etymology here - we all know where it directly came from, and as such it is still very strongly linked to homosexuality, reminding people of it everytime the word is said.

Similarly, all the other non-straight words/phrases I mentioned that are used in a derogatory manner are also linked to anti-gay prejudices.

I'm not wrong. There is ABSOLUTELY NO PROOF that you are born gay. I'm not done talking. I happen to be very anti-gay. You see blacks and gay people because uniquinous always find a way to bring a homosexual discussion to any thread where the word Gay is used.Yeah it's just that you're not right either, as there is ABSOLUTELY NO PROOF that you are born straight. Are you anti-black as well? :huh: just wondering

Just because I disagree with you and everyone here (Probably all quite liberal) doesn't make me a dumbass. It means I have my own opinions. And Zander, for this, all i have to say to you is "Fuck You"No, you're not a dumbass for disagreeing with people. You're a dumbass for being a prejudiced bigot. It means you have your own opinions, and not all opinions are equal. Some opinions are much better then others, and yours, quite frankly, suck.

.MinD.

09-26-2006, 09:09 AM

Uniquinous,

When have I ever said a bad thing about black people? I am just saying they don't have a choice how they're born, and that is why it is morally wrong to insult them. People who are gay do have a choice, and until you can prove me wrong, I'm going to think I'm right. I'm not a prejudiced bigot, I have no problem with other races or religions, just gay people. If i'm a bigot for thinking higher of straight people than gay people, then so be it.

Quit putting words in my mouth, uniquinous. Why are people saying I'm a racist? Have i said one bad word about black people?

Who are you to tell me my opinions suck? I think your opinions suck. Why do you have to be ambiguous to prove a point. I am starting to think that you're in fact a gay male. Why else could you be so sensitive about hte issue? And you don't share your gender, because if you do not, people will automatically think you're a female and give you special attention.

My other reasons for being anti gay...

It is against what the bible says. It is not intended for humans to be gay, there is only one way to reproduce. If god had wanted gay people to be roaming, there would be another way. A gay way.

Still, my main problem is that people have a choice to become gay. When someone can prove this wrong, I will surely take back everything I've said, and apologize.

Arite, so you aren't born straight or gay, uniq? So you do CHOOSE to become gay. Which is my point, that you have a chioce.

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 09:21 AM

.MinD.

09-26-2006, 09:24 AM

Too bad even science has proven your bigotry wrong.

And I'm still waiting, Jeffery, you Dumbass.

.MinD.

09-26-2006, 09:28 AM

i'm not putting words in your mouth. I asked you a question. It was a simple question: are you anti-black as well? The answer, as you just explained, is no.

However, you ARE a prejudiced bigot. You have yet to say why being gay is wrong or why you are in the place to say the "choice" of being gay is better then the "choice" of being straight. It's just a choice, right? Like applies and bananas? Sorry to disaapoint you, but I'm arguing you, like others, because you're condemnation of a perfectly innocent group of people is uncalled for, and such prejudice should be exterminated from this planet. It has nothing to do with my own orientation - I just have a habit for standing up for basic human rights.

So can you give us a single reason you are anti-gay? I don't think I saw one yet (or perhaps I just don't know what "ont" means).

btw, when you're walking down the street and you see a hot girl, do you CHOOSE her to be hot? :huh:

Yes, you do choose her to be hot. People think different things are attractive in women. Some people like skinny blonde girls, others like busty brunettes.

Uniquinous, I really don't have a problem with gays on a personal level. I'm sure some are good people, I just strongly disagree with a choice that they've made. I'm a religious man, and I feel strongly about some things.

Also, just wondering how does you standing up for basic human rights require you to be ambigous? I could say i'm a white male, and still have the same stances as you, and protect everyone. I could also say i'm an asian female, and still stand up. It won't make people think any differently of you. Not unless they have some preconceived notion about what races are supposed to stand for.

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 09:28 AM

i just realized - by your logic, MinD, people choose to be gay just as they choose to blink, or breathe :rolleyes:

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 09:32 AM

Yes, you do choose her to be hot. People think different things are attractive in women. Some people like skinny blonde girls, others like busty brunettes. See at the start you say you choose her to be hot. But in that same paragraph you reword it as "people like...". What you like is not necessarily a concious choice. Acting on what you like IS a choice. Sugar tastes sweet. That's not a choice my brain makes. I LIKE breathing. Get the idea?

Uniquinous, I really don't have a problem with gays on a personal level. I'm sure some are good people, I just strongly disagree with a choice that they've made. But you haven't said WHY you disagree with their "choice". (and yes, you clearly do have a problem with gays on a personal level if you are so prejudiced against them).

How does you standing up for basic human rights require you to be ambigous? I could say i'm a white male, and still have the same stances as you. I could also say i'm an asian female, and still stand up. It won't make people think any differently of you.It doesn't require me to be ambigious. I'm ambigious in hopes that people will question their preconcieved stupidities. For example, you just assumed that, since I'm standing up for the gay population, that I must be gay. You have no reason to believe that foolish thought whatsoever, but you were quick to make the baseless judgement nonetheless

.MinD.

09-26-2006, 09:41 AM

See at the start you say you choose her to be hot. But in that same paragraph you reword it as "people like...". What you like is not a choice. Acting on what you like IS a choice. Sugar tastes sweet. That's not a choice my brain makes. I LIKE breathing. Get the idea?

Breathing is done on a subconcious level. So is having your heart beat. They're not choices.

But you haven't said WHY you disagree with their "choice". (and yes, you clearly do have a problem with gays on a personal level if you are so prejudiced against them).

I have . I'm religious, and it goes against what I believe. Don't tell me I have a problem with them on a personal level. I know who or what I have problems with.

It doesn't require me to be ambigious. I'm ambigious in hopes that people will question their preconcieved stupidities. For example, you just assumed that, since I'm standing up for the gay population, that I must be gay. You have no reason to believe that foolish thought whatsoever, but you were quick to make the baseless judgement nonetheless

Nah, I was just taking a personal shot at you. Eh, just people like you annoy me, if you are what I think you're like. Trying to change the world, eh? :p

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 09:57 AM

Breathing is done on a subconcious level. So is having your heart beat. They're not choices.Breathing can very easily be consciously controlled. Now, again I ask, when you find a girl attractive, is that a conscious or subconscious choice? When you find sugar sweet is that conscious or subconscious choice?

I have . I'm religious, and it goes against what I believe. Don't tell me I have a problem with them on a personal level. I know who or what I have problems with.So, because someone tells you it's wrong, you believe it without question. OK, why does it go against what you believe? Why is it wrong?

Nah, I was just taking a personal shot at you. Eh, just people like you annoy me, if you are what I think you're like. Trying to change the world, eh? :pPeople "like me", eh? Yeah, you're not prejudiced at all. "if I am what you think i'm like". :rolleyes: You don't actually know me - you just made yet another rash assumption based on a greater generalization as to why you should dislike me. That pretty much defines 'prejudiced bigot'.

Lemme ask you something - in your opinion, did you choose that religion of yours freely? Or is the only reason you belong to that religion because your parents brought you up on that mindset? Just want to know your point of view.

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 12:39 PM

back to the point:All parodies are parodies, eh? My! How did you acquire such wisdom! And yet, you still lack the clarity to see that, even tho a parady is a parady, not all parodies are the same. Until you can acknowledge that, do shut up.
You LOVE to repeat yourself. I already responded to parodies can be different. As I said, I don't care. A parody in itself is one of itself. You use parody and insult others for their use of it. You are drawing fine lines, that society shouldn't have to regard, because they are only important in your head.

ah i see, it only means "crap" in regards to inatimate objects :rolleyes: Can you perhaps give me a single other example of a word that means one thing when referring to objects and something completely different when referring to people?
Read. Slowly. I said most of the time. Plenty of words have two meanings which have to be determined by their use. Hell. The term gay didn't originally mean homosexual! It meant merry at first. Words change.

Surely, in all your stupidity, you realize the etymology of the word. Actually I found urbandictionary entries the most amusing, but the one that serves my purpose is:
RIGHT! As I said already, origin doesn't matter. The word is used like that, today. If you're looking into origin to bitch about things, you're just ASKING for trouble, and nobody will care in the end.

Similarly, all the other non-straight words/phrases I mentioned that are used in a derogatory manner are also linked to anti-gay prejudices.
Maybe you just have a deep hate against homosexuals? I think queer, I think messed up. I don't link things in everyday life to homosexuality.

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 12:42 PM

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 12:58 PM

You LOVE to repeat yourself. I already responded to parodies can be different. As I said, I don't care. A parody in itself is one of itself. You use parody and insult others for their use of it. You are drawing fine lines, that society shouldn't have to regard, because they are only important in your head.No, I just hold society to an intellectual standard to differentiate between on joke using a deragatory word, and another joke that ironically goes against a main point. Tell me dirka, if you want to claim that "gay" in his example only means "sucks" (or some deviation thereof), why is it funny? What's "the joke" of it?

Let me just answer that now: it was a joke at the expense of gay people. If you disagree, please elaborate how "that sucks" is a joke".

Read. Slowly. I said most of the time. Plenty of words have two meanings which have to be determined by their use. Hell. The term gay didn't originally mean homosexual! It meant merry at first. Words change.Ah words do change! However, the definition of the word "etymology" refers to tracing the evolution of words. Evolution. Yes, it once meant merry, but that's not where the complete reversal of meaning came from. It went on to "homosexual" and FROM "homosexual" to "sucks". Similarly, humans were once one-celled organisms, but we evolved. Lizards were also once one cell organisms, but they evolved. And yet, humans don't come from lizards. There's a natural progression you need to look at here: etymology. Merry --> sexually promiscious --> homosexual --> crap.

So yeah, words change, but you CANT ingnore HOW they change. How do you suppose we got "crap" from "homosexual"? Now your answer is "words change". How wonderfully insightful. My response is "homophobia, especially seen in teens, altered homosexual-associated words into very derogatory insults." hmm... it's almost as if... observed behavior of this society... directly follows my explanation!

RIGHT! As I said already, origin doesn't matter. The word is used like that, today. If you're looking into origin to bitch about things, you're just ASKING for trouble, and nobody will care in the end.Actually there's a rather large movement of people who DO care. The origin DOES matter, as it directly insults the original group of people. Similarly, "nigger" can never be "just changed" as you suggest. You will never see people in the future refer to random objects as "nigger". You will never hear "my god that movie was such a nigger". Do you honestly not see how word origins, history, and etymology affect perception?

Can you honestly say that when you hear someone call an object "gay" you in absolutely no way associate a derogatory comment with homosexuality? Either you're that dumb, or that oblivious to your own mind.

Speaking of .MinD., at least we both agree on something...

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 01:16 PM

No, I just hold society to an intellectual standard to differentiate between on joke using a deragatory word, and another joke that ironically goes against a main point. Tell me dirka, if you want to claim that "gay" in his example only means "sucks" (or some deviation thereof), why is it funny? What's "the joke" of it?

Let me just answer that now: it was a joke at the expense of gay people. If you disagree, please elaborate how "that sucks" is a joke".
So what is the difference between the connection of a deragatory word and the allusion the someone's balls? They are both out of line to the same degree. You might disagree. That's the thing, as I said before. You can disagree all you want. That only matters in your small world. Push it on us all you want. Just don't pretend to be the moral and justified person.

Ah words do change! However, the definition of the word "etymology" refers to tracing the evolution of words. Evolution. Yes, it once meant merry, but that's not where the complete reversal of meaning came from. It went on to "homosexual" and FROM "homosexual" to "sucks". Similarly, humans were once one-celled organisms, but we evolved. Lizards were also once one cell organisms, but they evolved. And yet, humans don't come from lizards. There's a natural progression you need to look at here: etymology. Merry --> sexually promiscious --> homosexual --> crap.
Be that as it may, origin doesn't matter here (as I said how many times). He wasn't insulting homosexuals. He was using a word that meant "crap." Now, do homosexuals have the right to get pissed off? Sure! The thing is though, they also borrowed the word, and it isn't like we go around calling "crappy" things homosexual. Also look at where the word developed from. Gay as anything "crappy" came up from middle schools. When we (generally, in cases, which apear to be the norm) are growing up we have alot more prejustices then when we do when we are older. The word carried through though. It's childish, sure! Doesn't make it any less colloquial to mean "crappy" and not be an insult against homosexuals.

So yeah, words change, but you CANT ingnore HOW they change. How do you suppose we got "crap" from "homosexual"? Now your answer is "words change". How wonderfully insightful. My response is "homophobia, especially seen in teens, altered homosexual-associated words into very derogatory insults." hmm... it's almost as if... observed behavior of this society... directly follows my explanation!
The first part of that was answered above. The second, homophobia, I'll address here. Tell me where in this line of though you disagree. 1. Fear of things we don't understand is normal. 2. Most males who are not homosexual, and even some that are, don't understand homosexuality. 3. Homophobia is derived from not understanding homosexuality.
I'd think it would be #3. You'll probably argue that the homophobia that we are talking about isn't a real fear, but some middle school kids who use the word insultingly. Maybe so. That doesn't make true homophobia any less real.

Actually there's a rather large movement of people who DO care. The origin DOES matter, as it directly insults the original group of people. Similarly, "nigger" can never be "just changed" as you suggest. You will never see people in the future refer to random objects as "nigger". You will never hear "my god that movie was such a nigger". Do you honestly not see how word origins, history, and etymology affect perception?
I'm happy you brought that word into this right here. So far, nigger has been used as a good noun amoung some of the black community. No doubt there are people who are not black who use the word nigger and are accepted in black communities to use it. Nigger was bad and now can be good/bad. Just as gay was good and now can be good/bad. How do you know that a community, be it black or white, won't adapt the word nigger in such a way that it can be used as an adjective? I've sure as hell heard of crazier things. Granted though, it probably won't happen.

Can you honestly say that when you hear someone call an object "gay" you in absolutely no way associate a derogatory comment with homosexuality? Either you're that dumb, or that oblivious to your own mind.
That is the thing. It depends! Mostly that isn't how the word gay is used. However, I've sure heard it used like that. More often though, I see homo used to be a derogatory term against homosexuality. However, when I see/hear "gay" I don't often think of homosexuality.

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 01:33 PM

ok ok ok so it seems we actually agree with each other more then we let on, but there are still some things that don't line up:

First and foremost you completely ignored a valid question: please elaborate how "that sucks" is a joke. You said it was a joke. You said gay means "sucks" and ONLY that. So, how was the phrase "that sucks" used as a joke if it had no reference to and in no way was at the expense of homosexuals?

Be that as it may, origin doesn't matter here (as I said how many times). He wasn't insulting homosexuals. He was using a word that meant "crap." Now, do homosexuals have the right to get pissed off? Sure! The thing is though, they also borrowed the word, and it isn't like we go around calling "crappy" things homosexual. Also look at where the word developed from. Gay as anything "crappy" came up from middle schools. When we (generally, in cases, which apear to be the norm) are growing up we have alot more prejustices then when we do when we are older. The word carried through though. It's childish, sure! Doesn't make it any less colloquial to mean "crappy" and not be an insult against homosexuals.Yes, you've done a very good job of saying it doesn't matter many times. And yet, you still haven't backed this unfounded claim whatsoever. I present strong evidence of how the etymology of the word is still very strongly tied to it. Now you *could* argue that some time in the future the word "gay" will have NO association with homosexuality, but that's clearly not the case today. How can I tell? Because of the ton of news and crap people get over it - because of the movements to "reclaim the word" (as if those ever do anything...)

Yes you're right in saying they borrowed the word, but it was not at the expense of some other group. Robin Hood's 'merry' men didn't get offended that they were associated with homosexuals (besides, chances are a large number of men running off into the woods and living with each other in the trees isn't exactly the most heterosexual experience in the world). So no, the two changes can NOT be compared similarly.

You'll probably argue that the homophobia that we are talking about isn't a real fear, but some middle school kids who use the word insultingly. Maybe so. That doesn't make true homophobia any less real.No I actually agree with all of those numbers. My qualm is putting up with them. OK so middle school kids feared the unknown of homosexuality (combined with the fact that majority groups naturally are exclusionary towards minority groups). We let that fear, that homophobia, that sexual superiority complex be fostered, and we continue to give our tacit allowance everytime we don't say something to stop such immaturity. The word is not changed, it's very much still changing, and we as a society are allowing it. That's my pet peeve.

I'm happy you brought that word into this right here. So far, nigger has been used as a good noun amoung some of the black community. No doubt there are people who are not black who use the word nigger and are accepted in black communities to use it. Nigger was bad and now can be good/bad. Just as gay was good and now can be good/bad. How do you know that a community, be it black or white, won't adapt the word nigger in such a way that it can be used as an adjective? I've sure as hell heard of crazier things. Granted though, it probably won't happen.Ah but it's not being used by all of society. The term nigger is primarily used by the african american community. In a sense, they "own" and control the word that pertains to themselves. Our situation is opposite: everyone outside the gay community uses it to their own means carelessly. Yes, who uses it makes a large difference. If a Jew walks into a synagogue and says "I'm surrounded by jews", it's much much different then if a KKK member points his finger at someone's face and says "I'm surrounded by these jews". Ownership matters. Black community, the people "nigger" originated from, own the word. Homosexuals don't own "gay", even though that community is the word's origin.

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 01:55 PM

First and foremost you completely ignored a valid question: please elaborate how "that sucks" is a joke. You said it was a joke. You said gay means "sucks" and ONLY that. So, how was the phrase "that sucks" used as a joke if it had no reference to and in no way was at the expense of homosexuals?
Fair enough that the word "gay" is in the swear word filter for its connections to being a derogatory term against homosexuals. If "sucks" was in the swear word filter, for any reason, the joke would've been just as obvious considering the thread was about the filter.

Yes, you've done a very good job of saying it doesn't matter many times. And yet, you still haven't backed this unfounded claim whatsoever. I present strong evidence of how the etymology of the word is still very strongly tied to it. Now you *could* argue that some time in the future the word "gay" will have NO association with homosexuality, but that's clearly not the case today. How can I tell? Because of the ton of news and crap people get over it - because of the movements to "reclaim the word" (as if those ever do anything...)
That's all good and warented. Have you not heard "homo" used as an insulting term against homosexuality. The term itself, I feel, doesn't matter. That is why I feel connotation matters. I wouldn't mind if a homosexual called something straight, and meant it as a bad thing. Maybe that is a little different though, being that a large group isn't using the term straight badly.

No I actually agree with all of those numbers. My qualm is putting up with them. OK so middle school kids feared the unknown of homosexuality (combined with the fact that majority groups naturally are exclusionary towards minority groups). We let that fear, that homophobia, that sexual superiority complex be fostered, and we continue to give our tacit allowance everytime we don't say something to stop such immaturity. The word is not changed, it's very much still changing, and we as a society are allowing it. That's my pet peeve.
Here is the thing though. I can see your pet peeve and I'll admit that is true, although honestly myself I couldn't care less about that situation in society. However, homophobia doesn't necessarily contain a sexual superiority. I can admit I fear alot of things that I don't understand. I also can admit I don't understand homosexuals. I don't feel a sexual superiority. I also don't fully understand being straight (or why/what seperates the two), while that is my preference without doubt. I can say, to a degree, I have a homophobia.

Ah but it's not being used by all of society. The term nigger is primarily used by the african american community. In a sense, they "own" and control the word that pertains to themselves. Our situation is opposite: everyone outside the gay community uses it to their own means carelessly. Yes, who uses it makes a large difference. If a Jew walks into a synagogue and says "I'm surrounded by jews", it's much much different then if a KKK member points his finger at someone's face and says "I'm surrounded by these jews". Ownership matters. Black community, the people "nigger" originated from, own the word. Homosexuals don't own "gay", even though that community is the word's origin.
Maybe nigger and gay are hand in hand as far as insult goes, when they are subjected to people. As soon as the word nigger was used to describe something crappy though, I wouldn't be against it. (aside for that it sounds weird) People take words too seriously. Maybe I take them too lightly.

Frozen Toast

09-26-2006, 02:23 PM

Finish It It thats a word we cannot use on tao,Look at the bold for the slow ones :huh:

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 02:26 PM

Finish It It thats a word we cannot use on tao,Look at the bold for the slow ones :huh:

You are a slow one.

Jax'D

09-26-2006, 02:50 PM

I typed "finish it" in a game, and it became ####. That's gay.

HAHAHAHAHA LMAO!

Cuathon

09-26-2006, 04:49 PM

mind has no respect from me whatsoever. whether or not uni is going about the arguement the wrong way i despise people with religions that are against gays.
it an ignorant stance with absolutely no value. i wont go into my problems with religion but in regards to the gay issue they are mostly very bigoted. the kind of god that disavows gays doesnt deserve to rule over his own toenail. and he should get a little of the crap he gives to them.

Realist

09-26-2006, 07:24 PM

I typed "finish it" in a game, and it became ####. That's gay.

No...if it was gay, you'd get kicked.

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 07:33 PM

That's all good and warented. Have you not heard "homo" used as an insulting term against homosexuality. The term itself, I feel, doesn't matter. That is why I feel connotation matters. I wouldn't mind if a homosexual called something straight, and meant it as a bad thing. Maybe that is a little different though, being that a large group isn't using the term straight badly.Yes, it is a lot different, and I think that is the source of our disagreement. You actually find similar situations with white people's thoughts about the black community (this happens with any majority-minority set, I'm just using this as an example). It's been shown pretty well that the white population on average just doesn't understand what it's like to be black in America.

Here is the thing though. I can see your pet peeve and I'll admit that is true, although honestly myself I couldn't care less about that situation in society. However, homophobia doesn't necessarily contain a sexual superiority. I can admit I fear alot of things that I don't understand. I also can admit I don't understand homosexuals. I don't feel a sexual superiority. I also don't fully understand being straight (or why/what seperates the two), while that is my preference without doubt. I can say, to a degree, I have a homophobia.This further elaborates on the disagreement. It doesn't affect you negatively, so it doesn't matter to you. That's reasonable, but it doesn't mean that it's a trivial matter. Just because it doesn't have the potential to weigh heavily on your life doesn't mean it can't make someone else miserable. So the question comes down to "is this word reasonably able to upset certain people?" And the answer is clearly yes.

Drunk With Hate

09-26-2006, 09:15 PM

I can definitly agree with that.

Coffin Fedder

09-26-2006, 10:40 PM

I mean sure, the swear blocker has improved the game a little bit. But, why don't we get the same thing Legends has. Yes FPS'ers LEGENDS IT EXISTS! Were I'm chilling now. /censor choose weather or not you can see the words or not. I think its completly stupid that you can't say anything just about now without getting disconnected.

uniquinous

09-26-2006, 11:21 PM

1968, the day after MLK Jr was assasinated.

Jane Eliot, a 3rd grade school-teacher wanted to demonstrate prejudice to her classroom and what it can do to people. She wanted to show how people within majority groups have NO CLUE how minorities are discriminated against.

Elliott divided her class by eye color. On the first day, the blue-eyed children were told they were smarter, nicer, neater, and better than those with brown eyes. Throughout the day, Elliott praised them and allowed them privileges. In contrast, the brown-eyed children had to wear collars around their necks and their behavior and performance were criticized and ridiculed by Elliott. On the second day, the roles were reversed and the blue-eyed children were made to feel inferior while the brown eyes were designated the dominant group.

On both days, children who were designated as inferior took on the look and behavior of genuinely inferior students, performing poorly on tests and other work. In contrast, the "superior" students -- students who had been sweet and tolerant before the exercise -- became mean-spirited and seemed to like discriminating against the "inferior" group.

"I watched what had been marvelous, cooperative, wonderful, thoughtful children turn into nasty, vicious, discriminating little third-graders in a space of fifteen minutes," says Elliott. She says she realized then that she had "created a microcosm of society in a third-grade classroom."

For video documentation of this extraordinary event, Click Here (http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/divided/etc/view.html).

The fact is, people don't know how words hurt. We don't. We're naturally oblivious. Let me tell you I've seen the pain first hand: language such as "that's gay" hurts people.

kckaji

09-26-2006, 11:30 PM

You guys talk way too much in this thread. It hurts my eyes. I must never come to this thread again. hehe.

shatterstar

09-26-2006, 11:55 PM

to uniq, you havent finished your other argument in GD yet. :p

and mind, please learn to think for yourself, accept the rest of the world and not listen to religious dogma.

Tama Drummer

09-27-2006, 12:11 AM

Let me tell you I've seen the pain first hand: language such as "that's gay" hurts people.

Such language also makes people happy (laugh), apparently.

uniquinous

09-27-2006, 09:12 AM

Yes, hanging black people made people laugh back in the day as well. Heck RAPE makes people happy, right?

Just because you're not the one being hurt by it does NOT make it harmless.

Lord Sesshomaru

09-27-2006, 12:46 PM

This thread is STILL going? Sheesh...

Drunk With Hate

09-27-2006, 12:54 PM

Yes, hanging black people made people laugh back in the day as well. Heck RAPE makes people happy, right?

There is a difference. Physical harm compared to what? Verbal abuse? Even our laws show the difference clearly, wherein physical harm is folloed by much worse punishment.

Jeffery

09-27-2006, 01:06 PM

There is a difference. Physical harm compared to what? Verbal abuse? Even our laws show the difference clearly, wherein physical harm is folloed by much worse punishment.
Wait....

You mean if I say I am going to kill you I won;t be punished as much as if I do kill you???

:confused:

Drunk With Hate

09-27-2006, 01:07 PM

Wait....

You mean if I say I am going to kill you I won;t be punished as much as if I do kill you???

:confused:

Weird, isn't it.

Tama Drummer

09-27-2006, 02:19 PM

Yes, hanging black people made people laugh back in the day as well. Heck RAPE makes people happy, right?

Just because you're not the one being hurt by it does NOT make it harmless.

Uh... I don't think hanging or raping people is really too comparable with saying, "That's gay."

And when someone was hung, and people would've laughed, that's different from laughing at "that's gay." If someone laughs at someone being hung, that's because they were racist against blacks. When I say, "that's gay," I'm not thinking homosexuals suck.

Of course, I know that not being hurt personally doesn't mean it's harmless. But if you take everything in this world away because it causes someone harm.... what's left? The exact fraise, "that's gay," seems so minute and harmless to the average person. One of the graduates of my school last year was openly gay, and used "that's gay" to say something sucked. The amount of people that are greatly harmed from it is probably very few.

The main reason I was saying that, you're telling me words hurt. And yet to do so, you call me ignorant, prejudiced, stupid, homophobic, and a moron. Who's to say that doesn't "hurt" me?

uniquinous

09-27-2006, 06:19 PM

Uh... I don't think hanging or raping people is really too comparable with saying, "That's gay."You're right, it's not. I used your reason, which was "Such language also makes people happy". This has been the only reason you've stated thusfar as to why you use that phrase, and I shot it down. If you'd like to give another reason as to why you find it funny, go right ahead, and I'd be more then happy to shoot that one down as well.

And when someone was hung, and people would've laughed, that's different from laughing at "that's gay." If someone laughs at someone being hung, that's because they were racist against blacks. When I say, "that's gay," I'm not thinking homosexuals suck.And yet, you still miss the point. Doesn't matter if YOU find it offensive, or even related... it still is.

Of course, I know that not being hurt personally doesn't mean it's harmless. But if you take everything in this world away because it causes someone harm.... what's left?Whoa now, let's not minimalize this out of proportion. This isn't one or two people saying "you hurt my feelings". This is you directly harming every kid who was ever scared to come out of the closet. This is you forcing people to hide their emotions and who they are because you belittle the same word that describes who they are. Heck that quote right there pretty much suggests you can be slanderous to any minority you want because you are a while American male. Heck by your logic we might as well nationally refer to the African American race as "niggers" because, we shouldn't take things away that causes harm. But you would never make THAT claim, as it would make you look prejudiced :rolleyes:

The exact fraise, "that's gay," seems so minute and harmless to the average person. One of the graduates of my school last year was openly gay, and used "that's gay" to say something sucked. The amount of people that are greatly harmed from it is probably very few.No, it seems minute and harmless to straight people. It seems harmless to you. I've already pointed out a well documented and repeatable study which directly shows how minority groups have absolutely NO IDEA of how their words harm minority groups. You fall directly into this category, naturally. Did you actually watch the video I referenced or read anything more on it? Do you realize fights broke out because one of the blue eyed kids called a brown eyed kid "brown eyes"? You don't even realize the weight such terms, whether true, whether trivial-appearing, whether senseless, whether you find them harmless, can actually upset a struggling minority. A minority, btw, which is estimated to be between 5-10% of Americans. Lemme just put that in perspective: 12% of America is black. Not too far off.

So you say a gay guy last year said "gay". And yet, I made a whole post on african americans saying and owning the word "nigger". You seemed to miss this. To rephrase: being a member of the group allows for control over negative words. If a Jew walks into synagogue and says "I'm surrounded by all these Jews!" it's much different then a member of the KKK pointing at someone at claiming "you Jew!". "brown eyes". You still don't understand what you can do.

The main reason I was saying that, you're telling me words hurt. And yet to do so, you call me ignorant, prejudiced, stupid, homophobic, and a moron. Who's to say that doesn't "hurt" me?Has a gay person ever hurt you or done anything to incur under-the-breath subconscious or unrealized prejudice from you? Has a gay person every done anything that deserves your deragatory remarks? Now, in contrast, have you done something that shows how little you about this topic? The answer is: clearly. There's a different between broad generalized prejudices that affect and target many in one word regardless of how innocent/guilrty/cute/ugly/etc they may be, and very direct responses based off of actions.

Serge

09-27-2006, 07:31 PM

You're right, it's not. I used your reason, which was "Such language also makes people happy". This has been the only reason you've stated thusfar as to why you use that phrase, and I shot it down. If you'd like to give another reason as to why you find it funny, go right ahead, and I'd be more then happy to shoot that one down as well.

And yet, you still miss the point. Doesn't matter if YOU find it offensive, or even related... it still is.

Whoa now, let's not minimalize this out of proportion. This isn't one or two people saying "you hurt my feelings". This is you directly harming every kid who was ever scared to come out of the closet. This is you forcing people to hide their emotions and who they are because you belittle the same word that describes who they are. Heck that quote right there pretty much suggests you can be slanderous to any minority you want because you are a while American male. Heck by your logic we might as well nationally refer to the African American race as "niggers" because, we shouldn't take things away that causes harm. But you would never make THAT claim, as it would make you look prejudiced :rolleyes:

No, it seems minute and harmless to straight people. It seems harmless to you. I've already pointed out a well documented and repeatable study which directly shows how minority groups have absolutely NO IDEA of how their words harm minority groups. You fall directly into this category, naturally. Did you actually watch the video I referenced or read anything more on it? Do you realize fights broke out because one of the blue eyed kids called a brown eyed kid "brown eyes"? You don't even realize the weight such terms, whether true, whether trivial-appearing, whether senseless, whether you find them harmless, can actually upset a struggling minority. A minority, btw, which is estimated to be between 5-10% of Americans. Lemme just put that in perspective: 12% of America is black. Not too far off.

So you say a gay guy last year said "gay". And yet, I made a whole post on african americans saying and owning the word "nigger". You seemed to miss this. To rephrase: being a member of the group allows for control over negative words. If a Jew walks into synagogue and says "I'm surrounded by all these Jews!" it's much different then a member of the KKK pointing at someone at claiming "you Jew!". "brown eyes". You still don't understand what you can do.

Has a gay person ever hurt you or done anything to incur under-the-breath subconscious or unrealized prejudice from you? Has a gay person every done anything that deserves your deragatory remarks? Now, in contrast, have you done something that shows how little you about this topic? The answer is: clearly. There's a different between broad generalized prejudices that affect and target many in one word regardless of how innocent/guilrty/cute/ugly/etc they may be, and very direct responses based off of actions.

That's gay.

Tama Drummer

09-27-2006, 07:35 PM

Fine. :rolleyes:
You've obviously studied the word "gay" much more than me. Doesn't really change my opinion on how I'll use it though...

Ächilles

09-27-2006, 08:59 PM

"Gay" is really common slang here (Boston). We say it all the time.

I don't say it because I associate negative acts or events with gay people, I say it just because I grew up around it. If I don't like something, it's "wicked gay." It just comes out, since we've always said it here. It's not like I'm "wow, this pasta is really lame... just like those Homosexual people." It's just a term that's gained it's own meaning as "bad." I mean no disrespect to the actual gay population, but it's a saying that I'll never stop saying simply because I don't consciously decide to say it.

Wizzy`

09-27-2006, 09:50 PM

That's gay.

So gay.

Drunk With Hate

09-27-2006, 09:52 PM

So gay.

You're gay.

uniquinous

09-27-2006, 10:38 PM

Fine. :rolleyes:
You've obviously studied the word "gay" much more than me. Doesn't really change my opinion on how I'll use it though...
Yes, so next time I call you ignorant, this is why.

"Gay" is really common slang here (Boston). We say it all the time.

I don't say it because I associate negative acts or events with gay people, I say it just because I grew up around it. If I don't like something, it's "wicked gay." It just comes out, since we've always said it here. It's not like I'm "wow, this pasta is really lame... just like those Homosexual people." It's just a term that's gained it's own meaning as "bad." I mean no disrespect to the actual gay population, but it's a saying that I'll never stop saying simply because I don't consciously decide to say it.yeah, i was actually surprised upon coming to boston to find it so woven into native language. You have to see though, it's only really fostered within younger, undereducated, or otherwise underpriveledged people. I'ma assume you're in the first group ;) What I mean tho is, you won't find an older business man or professional use it in language. For all I know tho, the trend will change over time to include it.

I don't think I'd mind it as much here in Boston if I didn't just come from a top liberal arts school which is crazy about these sortsa things. The difference is harshly noticeable.

You're gay.
you're homojewtarded, noobface. this was what my friends considered "the ultimate immature insult" - and in every way was meant to mock people who actually use "gay" in negative connotations - shut up i'll pwnz j00

meat.eater

09-27-2006, 10:53 PM

Everybody. Let's have make-up sex.

Here's the thing. It's funny how straight people find it so necessary to defend homosexuals for the negative connotations. Though you may be correct and have a point, its just interesting because it would appear queers have a thicker skin about it than straighties do. It's heard daily. Yeah, it's insulting, but shit, if you hang on what other people say constantly, life will suck. I dont like it when life sucks. Also - It doesnt make them homophobic, it just makes them young, naive, and a bit dumb.

Now...

How many young, naive, dumb people do we have on TAO? Thanks for the thoughts Uniquin, but thats like a 4,000 - 2 battle I'm not willing to participate in.

Like I said. Make up sex. Queer make up sex, even. Y'all seem to be comfortable with that. I say, if it's so "gay," do it up the butt instead of argue. If you're a dork, be a dork, but realize someone wont give you the light of day. If you're a bit over sensitive, be droplets of water on a freshly painted deck.
fini.

EDIT: I totally screw3d up that metaphor, but I'm too lazy to fix it.

Scorpionz

09-28-2006, 04:04 AM

You're right, it's not. I used your reason, which was "Such language also makes people happy". This has been the only reason you've stated thusfar as to why you use that phrase, and I shot it down. If you'd like to give another reason as to why you find it funny, go right ahead, and I'd be more then happy to shoot that one down as well.

Many of us teens use "That's gay" just as a "That's dumb" We don't mean any harm to "Gay" people but it's just the slang we use.

And yet, you still miss the point. Doesn't matter if YOU find it offensive, or even related... it still is.

So gay people are allowed to say it but straights can't?

Whoa now, let's not minimalize this out of proportion. This isn't one or two people saying "you hurt my feelings". This is you directly harming every kid who was ever scared to come out of the closet. This is you forcing people to hide their emotions and who they are because you belittle the same word that describes who they are. Heck that quote right there pretty much suggests you can be slanderous to any minority you want because you are a while American male. Heck by your logic we might as well nationally refer to the African American race as "niggers" because, we shouldn't take things away that causes harm. But you would never make THAT claim, as it would make you look prejudiced :rolleyes:

They should'nt come out of the closet. :p

No, it seems minute and harmless to straight people. It seems harmless to you. I've already pointed out a well documented and repeatable study which directly shows how minority groups have absolutely NO IDEA of how their words harm minority groups. You fall directly into this category, naturally. Did you actually watch the video I referenced or read anything more on it? Do you realize fights broke out because one of the blue eyed kids called a brown eyed kid "brown eyes"? You don't even realize the weight such terms, whether true, whether trivial-appearing, whether senseless, whether you find them harmless, can actually upset a struggling minority. A minority, btw, which is estimated to be between 5-10% of Americans. Lemme just put that in perspective: 12% of America is black. Not too far off.

HmMmm

So you say a gay guy last year said "gay". And yet, I made a whole post on african americans saying and owning the word "nigger". You seemed to miss this. To rephrase: being a member of the group allows for control over negative words. If a Jew walks into synagogue and says "I'm surrounded by all these Jews!" it's much different then a member of the KKK pointing at someone at claiming "you Jew!". "brown eyes". You still don't understand what you can do.

Yeah, but they prefer to say it in front of us. ;)

Has a gay person ever hurt you or done anything to incur under-the-breath subconscious or unrealized prejudice from you? Has a gay person every done anything that deserves your deragatory remarks? Now, in contrast, have you done something that shows how little you about this topic? The answer is: clearly. There's a different between broad generalized prejudices that affect and target many in one word regardless of how innocent/guilrty/cute/ugly/etc they may be, and very direct responses based off of actions.

Well, Apart from wanting me to come to a "Special" party, I wouldn't think so.

Homosexuals don't own the word "Gay". Gay means happy theoretically.

-Dape-

09-28-2006, 04:18 AM

you're homoJewtarded, noobface.

Don't you like jews now?

Cuathon

09-28-2006, 05:27 AM

Northy, in case you missed it i specified not likking religions that discriminate vs. gays. i know some of them dont(in response to pos rep message by northy.)

Punishment

09-28-2006, 09:04 AM

What percent of America is gay uniquinous?

Also, Uniquinous, why do you make such a big deal about the GAY comments. You don't make this big of a deal for any other slang word, so gay must hit close to home somewhere.

I'm sure more black people will get offended by all of the white people who say "nigga" than gay people when someone says "that's gay".

Now, i must say, this whole gay debate, is Gay.

I get offended when people call me a TAO Nerd. How come you're not standing up for me uniq!!!! I'm sure more there are more nerds than gay people :p

Ehh, as for gay people. I don't really care if you're gay, just don't make a big deal about it. By making a big deal of it, i mean wearing bright rainbow shirts with gay pride pins on them. I don't go around with shirts saying im white, or that im straight. No need to make such a big deal of it. (Also, don't kiss in public, (or hold hands) it's gross :p)

uniquinous

09-28-2006, 10:26 AM

Everybody. Let's have make-up sex.
k

What percent of America is gay uniquinous?5-10%

Also, Uniquinous, why do you make such a big deal about the GAY comments. You don't make this big of a deal for any other slang word, so gay must hit close to home somewhere.

I get offended when people call me a TAO Nerd. How come you're not standing up for me uniq!!!! I'm sure more there are more nerds than gay people :pBecause you are a TAO nerd! I'm a nerd! Welcome to the club - if you're a nerd in school your gonna go to a better college and make more money then the non-nerds. Trust me when I say you will one day embrace your nerdiness. However, derogatory language against gays makes generalizations (this is pretty much the definition of prejudice) and doesn't look at the individual. However, if I find a really stupid person and call him dumb, or noob, or dumb-noob, it's because I am directly judging that one person. Similarly, people judge you for your chosen actions and deem you dork. It's not a blanket generalization.

Ehh, as for gay people. I don't really care if you're gay, just don't make a big deal about it. By making a big deal of it, i mean wearing bright rainbow shirts with gay pride pins on them. I don't go around with shirts saying im white, or that im straight. No need to make such a big deal of it. (Also, don't kiss in public, (or hold hands) it's gross :p)but you have to admit - that would be incredibly amusing...

altho, now that I think about it, it's probably not a good idea to go around with a shirt that says "white pride" on it...

Don't you like jews now?erm, check the black text, it's meant to be self-mocking. my dog is jew, so clearly I can't be discriminatin

They should'nt come out of the closet. :pHere's the thing. It's funny how straight people find it so necessary to defend homosexuals for the negative connotations. Though you may be correct and have a point, its just interesting because it would appear queers have a thicker skin about it than straighties do. It's heard daily. Yeah, it's insulting, but shit, if you hang on what other people say constantly, life will suck. I dont like it when life sucks. Also - It doesnt make them homophobic, it just makes them young, naive, and a bit dumb. Now here's the thing. when talking privately with you, meat, I got the sense that you had no problem "coming out of the closet". But you know that's not the case for a large majority of people. For some, it can really be excrutiatingly painful - they need to face the feedback of their friends, their religeous leaders, and their parents. It's very frightening! I think this is where my own mindset comes into play, cuz I've directly seen how scared some people can be of simply... being who they are. Why? Cuz this society discriminates in many many ways.

OK so meat eater is way over the threshold of tolerance to allow these little things to affect him. That's great. But until you've really seen a friend struggle with simply fitting into their own skin, you can't say this doesn't affect anyone. As long as there are people who are AFRAID to say who they are, my points are still valid.

And regardless of how many of you say "but it only means dumb now and isn't homophobic" the fact still remains that your meaning evolved from the fact that middle school and teenage kids began associated all things bad with homosexuality. Back in our parents childhood it was the emasculinization of boys with terms like "pansy". Wanted someone to feel like he's not a man? Call him a "woman". When I was in middle school it was "fag" (make him feel like he's not a straight man). But "you're gay" doesn't have the same flow as "you're a fag". However, citing OBJECTS, instead of PEOPLE, as gay, had the same edge. Thus, it came to mean all things crappy, but it was from homosexual in every way, shape, and form that it got this meaning.

It might not affect you, but look around your classroom tomorrow. 20 kids there? 2 of them are afraid to tell the world who they are because "gay" has such a negative connotation in this society.

Punishment

09-28-2006, 10:35 AM

k

5-10%

Ok.

Population of the USA according to http://www.census.gov is 299,852,984.

There are between ... 15 and 30 million gay people living america?

I find that hard to believe..

uniquinous

09-28-2006, 10:38 AM

why? is 5-10% hard to believe? Heck do you even know how many men will have homosexual encounters in their lifetime, many times repeatedly, and claim they aren't gay?

why is 5-10% hard to believe?

There are over 50,000 gay new yorkers alone (and that's just age 18+).

EDIT: check out http://www.gaydemographics.org

Punishment

09-28-2006, 10:44 AM

30 Million homosexuals would be like the entire state of California being homosexual...

I've read somewhere that just 1-2 percent consider themselves exclusively gay, and 5% consider themselves bisexual, but something like 20% have had a gay experience in their life.

I'm not sure, I'll try to find out where i read it :p

uniquinous

09-28-2006, 10:50 AM

yeah the numbers really range. And yes, it is a LOT of people, but they aren't all in one place. We can't cart all the gays off to an island somewhere and call it "Big Gay Island" WHY WOULD YOU EVEN SUGGEST SUCH A THING?!

but yeah, it's a lot of people. and there's no way to get an accurate count because so many still won't identify themselves as gay. Scientific America did a study (http://www.sciamdigital.com/index.cfm?fa=Products.ViewIssuePreview&ARTICLEID_CHAR=F9334FD1-2B35-221B-617C9516F54759A4) which showed 5-6% of the population lived with their significant other. Those are just the people who live together! Imagine all the single gays or live-alone gays out there!

Punishment

09-28-2006, 10:54 AM

uniquinous

09-28-2006, 11:02 AM

:eek: you're right! lemme go find another demographic study that looks at total gay population, not just couples....

EDIT: I found this (http://www.familyresearchinst.org/FRI_AIM_Talk.html) article which does a pretty good job of arguing both sides, but I don't quite think it's unbiased.

The problem with these studies is where you look and how you define your parameters. If the questions are "have you lived with and had sexual encounters exclusively with someone of the same sex as you for the past 5 years?" then the numbers are really low. If however the questions are "have you ever had a homosexual encounter, whether genitalia touched or not" then the numbers are >10%.

this (http://www.jstor.org/view/00703370/di014760/01p0053h/3?frame=noframe&userID=9b297001@bu.edu/01cc99334100501ef434a&dpi=3&config=jstor) chart seems to be pretty straight forward.

the fact is there's no way to tell.

Serge

09-28-2006, 04:21 PM

God bless America, where only minorities have rights.

Drunk With Hate

09-28-2006, 05:28 PM

There's nothing wrong with being gay. I have plenty of friends that are going to hell.

tarvos 6

09-28-2006, 05:38 PM

I dont agree with gay bashing, or any kind of bashing, and I dont think its worth arguing why, because 19 others have already done that. I just thought it was interesting to see a thread with a topic as "finish it" ... "That's gay." spark such a heated argument.

uniquinous

09-28-2006, 07:05 PM

God bless America, where only minorities have rights.Oh is that why white upper class people get beaten by the LA police and have evidence planted on them :rolleyes:

no but in all seriousness: go back to the vanilla factory, white-bread

Serge

09-28-2006, 08:05 PM

Oh is that why white upper class people get beaten by the LA police and have evidence planted on them :rolleyes:

no but in all seriousness: go back to the vanilla factory, white-bread
Who are you to say I'm not a minority?

uniquinous

09-28-2006, 08:36 PM

because you're a noob - quite a majority here :)

Punishment

09-28-2006, 09:06 PM

Uniquinous, it offends me when you call him noob.

Not saying im a noob, not saying im not. It just bothers me. How dare you judge him.

Gosh. It's so gay to call someone a noob.. :p

Ächilles

09-28-2006, 09:18 PM

yeah, i was actually surprised upon coming to boston to find it so woven into native language. You have to see though, it's only really fostered within younger, undereducated, or otherwise underpriveledged people. I'ma assume you're in the first group ;) What I mean tho is, you won't find an older business man or professional use it in language. For all I know tho, the trend will change over time to include it.

I don't think I'd mind it as much here in Boston if I didn't just come from a top liberal arts school which is crazy about these sortsa things. The difference is harshly noticeable.

I think we kind of get a pass on it, since we're more or less leading the way in the whole pro-gay marriage dispute. It's kind of like if you're black, you can call your buddies a "nigger." Most of the people here support gay marriage, so we get to use the term : )

But seriously, you're right, it most likely will change here EXCEPT for in Southie. That town never changes. (except for all the damn yuppies moving in... grrr...) Forty years ago my parents thought Aerosmith was "wicked pissa." Forty years later I think Aerosmith is "wicked pissa." Southie is more or less locked in the 1930's. Not much changes there. So next time you're strolling through Southie, and you see a really ugly car, just remember - it's wicked gay. Not anywhere else though.

meat.eater

09-28-2006, 10:22 PM

Being overly sensitive can be just as painful to a homosexual trying to come out and dealing with issues of being "different" as being insensitive.

uniquinous

09-28-2006, 11:50 PM

I think we kind of get a pass on it, since we're more or less leading the way in the whole pro-gay marriage dispute. It's kind of like if you're black, you can call your buddies a "nigger." Most of the people here support gay marriage, so we get to use the term : )

But seriously, you're right, it most likely will change here EXCEPT for in Southie. That town never changes. (except for all the damn yuppies moving in... grrr...) Forty years ago my parents thought Aerosmith was "wicked pissa." Forty years later I think Aerosmith is "wicked pissa." Southie is more or less locked in the 1930's. Not much changes there. So next time you're strolling through Southie, and you see a really ugly car, just remember - it's wicked gay. Not anywhere else though.

this is probably the best explanation i've heard (both of the term, and south boston)

Zander

09-29-2006, 12:07 AM

Also, Uniquinous, why do you make such a big deal about the GAY comments. You don't make this big of a deal for any other slang word, so gay must hit close to home somewhere.

the fact that you intended that to insult made your reputation in my books seriously drop

.................................................. .......................on your way now gents and ladies

Punishment

09-29-2006, 12:15 AM

the fact that you intended that to insult made your reputation in my books seriously drop

.................................................. .......................on your way now gents and ladies

Wasn't insulting uniq.

Was just saying it must be a sensitive issue for them if that is the one thing I've seen them get this worked up about.

Not saying that they're gay, or that they're not.

Zander

09-29-2006, 12:23 AM

but you are putting "them" all in the same pool.it offends me too, and I have no sexual urges towards my own gender whatsoever.when anything is done or said that's offensive in any way, it should be taken offensively by everyone, not just the people it's aimed at.for example; do you find the things that happened during the holocaust and the things hitler did offensive?i sure as hell do.I'm not jewish, people I care about are.not everyone thought it offensive at the time, some joined up with him and aided his cause, now everyone recognizes it as monstrous.eventually so will this ridiculous behavior towards people with homosexual tendencies.

Punishment

09-29-2006, 01:01 AM

Zander,

Again, I was not insulting gays, or uniq. I was just saying that it was a sensitive issue. In my previous post, I was referring to uniq as 'them' because I don't know their gender.

"Was just saying it must be a sensitive issue for them if that is the one thing I've seen them get this worked up about."

would have become

"Was just saying it must be a sensitive issue for him/her if that is the one thing I've seen him/her get this worked up about."

Probably doesn't make sense, but I'm tired, and I don't really care about the gr4mm4r 1n my s3ntcn3s.

Zander, how does me saying 'them' offend YOU.

Also, if someone says something as hurtful as "that's gay", I do NOT expect everyone to get worked up. I expect NOBODY to get worked up. It is a slang term widely used.

Do not tell me what to care about. I have no problem saying 'that's gay', and if it offends a few people that I don't know, I do not care. If a close friend of mine has a problem with me saying it, then I wouldn't say it around them.

Yea zander. I think the holocaust was great. Hitler is a hero. Don't be an ass. You can't compare the holocaust to saying "that's gay"

As I said before, I didn't call uniquinous gay. Maybe they know a few gay people, and that is why they are so adamant about this issue. Just pointing out that uniq never gets this worked up about someone calling someone fat, a noob, white, etc.

Scorpionz

09-29-2006, 05:04 AM

There's nothing wrong with being gay. I have plenty of friends that are going to hell.

That just made my day.

:rofl:

Lord Sesshomaru

09-29-2006, 08:36 AM

uniquinous

09-29-2006, 08:38 AM

see ya had me up till this point:

Do not tell me what to care about. I have no problem saying 'that's gay', and if it offends a few people that I don't know, I do not care. If a close friend of mine has a problem with me saying it, then I wouldn't say it around them.

What if your brother were gay, for example, and gets offended by that. Then suddenly it's not just about *you* not saying it around that person, it's about anyone saying it. Everytime your brothers friends say it in front of you and him you cringe inside too, knowing full well how it will hurt him. Now extend that out - make it a friend, a neighbor, a stranger.

I'm not gonna claim you're a nazi in any way, but a poem written (and altered) during the holocaust is pretty straight-forward:

They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me,
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

We, as a society, MUST stick up for minority rights. We can't take on apathy as an excuse. That laziness will be our downfall.

I'll end with a quote from an excellent movie:
"And I am reminded on this holy day of the sad story of Kitty Genovese. As you all may remember, long time ago almost 30 years ago. This poor soul cried out for help time and time again, but no person answered their calls. Though many saw, no one so much as called the police. They all just watched as Kitty was stabbed to death in broad daylight. They watched as her assailant walked away. Now, we must all fear evil men, but there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is, the indifference of good men. "

Punishment

09-29-2006, 09:51 AM

see ya had me up till this point:

What if your brother were gay, for example, and gets offended by that. Then suddenly it's not just about *you* not saying it around that person, it's about anyone saying it. Everytime your brothers friends say it in front of you and him you cringe inside too, knowing full well how it will hurt him. Now extend that out - make it a friend, a neighbor, a stranger.

I'm not gonna claim you're a nazi in any way, but a poem written (and altered) during the holocaust is pretty straight-forward:

They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me,
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

We, as a society, MUST stick up for minority rights. We can't take on apathy as an excuse. That laziness will be our downfall.

I'll end with a quote from an excellent movie:

Ehh

I don't think so. If i had a gay brother, an someone said something like "Man, I can't belive the A's beat the Angels. That's so gay"

I would agree. I don't have a problem with the phrase, and I understand the difference between a malicious comment, and the harmless slang. Now, I don't know how my brother would react to this if he was homosexual, but I think he has enough sense not to mind.

If someone came and laughed at my gay brother, and made fun of him. "haha, you're a gay faggot" or something, I'd probably react differently. They are different things. As i said, if someone I know personally has a problem with that, I won't say it around them. I have many other words in my vocabulary that means "that sucks".

Uniq, not too many people will stick up for my rights. I'm pretty well off. I live in a nice house in Orange County. I'm White, straight, I do fairly well in school. Why does nobody stand up for me when someone comes and laughs at me and calls me "whitie" I don't think it's nice. I'm sure if a black person came and someone called him "blackie", he wouldn't be too thrilled. So why am I obligated to stand up for him when he doesn't do the same in return?

uniquinous

09-29-2006, 10:10 AM

Ah I see. Well, let's look at that then. Why is there not a national movement to dampen such horrid terms as "whitie"? BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT A MINORITY. Because you can't point to a single moment in American history where white straight upper middle class males were discriminated against (first person to say reverse discrimination dies, and misses the point). Because minority populations such as blacks, hispanics, gays, and even women were severely hurt. Wounds heal slowly and leave scars.

The experiment I provided very clearly showed that seemingly normal kids would be emotionally harmed by being called "brown eyes" if the society around them deemed it was at any time a negative trait. Physical fights broke out because the blue eyed kids called the others "brown eyes"! The reverse was not true.

The problem is: the blue eyed kids, or any majority unaffected by discrimination for that matter, are just completely oblivious to the pain they can cause.

What does the term "whitie" hold to it? A history of being the dominant force in the country? It's not nearly as charged as "nigger". As such, you have no need for equal defenses of your rights - not because the RIGHTS are unequal, but because the CONSEQUENCES are.

As for your brother example: let's just assumed he got hurt everytime someone said "that's gay". Would you continue using it when you weren't around him? No, more likely you'd become aware of how the phrase can hurt someone close to you and stop using it altogether. That's how psychologically these things work.

Punishment

09-29-2006, 10:18 AM

HAH.

Women.

They annoy me :p

At my school last year, some girl pants'ed (sp) (when they pulled his pants down :p) a friend of mine in a classroom with the teacher present and all. Now, I laughed at the time, but I do think there should have been some punishment or something. Then, to get even, the same guy pantsed that girl later, and got a 5 day suspension. Girls can do anything and get away with it -_-.

Uniq, about that 3rd grader thing, I don't really think that's a good example. Sure , it had some results that support you, but they're third graders. mm, didn't finish my thought, i will in a sec, lol I'm not gonna read up on it or watch the video, but is it something like the Stanford Prison Experiment thing?

Uniq. I'm not a minority. Does that mean that nobody can stand up for me?

God bless America, where only minorities have rights.

uniquinous

09-29-2006, 10:43 AM

Uniq, about that 3rd grader thing, I don't really think that's a good example. Sure , it had some results that support you, but they're third graders. mm, didn't finish my thought, i will in a sec, lol I'm not gonna read up on it or watch the video, but is it something like the Stanford Prison Experiment thing?They repeated it, several times, with different age groups. Besides, kids are the best population to gain this insightful information from. But yeah, I believe the video shows a similar example with an older group as well.

Uniq. I'm not a minority. Does that mean that nobody can stand up for me?No, it means you have less things you need to have defended. The example you gave was injustice all the way - but that's not how our legal system works. The fact is, in the future there is no doubt that the principle will fear that girl harming a guy. It's MUCH more likely that a guy in our society will hit or rape a girl. There's a MUCH larger need to curb harmful behavior from men to women in this society. Thus, things are skewed. In your example though, you're right - it was silly that they gave inequal punishment for equal crimes.

But there's a difference between sex/gender/race injustices and basic general injustice. If the guy pantsed another guy would the same thing have happened? There are many factors here we're not looking at in this example.

Serge

09-29-2006, 04:29 PM

eunoch, you are such a farting idiot.

You're telling me, if a group of black guys pick on a white kid and say stuff like, "You punk-ass little cracker, why don't you drive home in your daddy's car?" he doesn't deserve any protection because he's part of the majority? It's okay if he gets picked on because of his race because people of his race did mean things before this kid was even born? That's cool. You're so smart.

And you can call me a noob, but I'm willing to wager that I'm more respected by the more intelligent members of this forum. Not because I'm a bloody genius like your minority self, but because I'm a farting human being.

uniquinous

09-29-2006, 04:39 PM

Forest_Archer

09-29-2006, 04:39 PM

cool.

once i put in a bad word and i got DC.;) jk

lol man ur so funny.

Tama, what was he finishing?

Ächilles

09-29-2006, 04:44 PM

I think the minority should be protected, but should not hold sway of the majority.

Example - protect minorities from that which they should be protected, but don't give them benefits JUST because they're minorities. That's a little absurd in my opinion.

Serge

09-29-2006, 04:44 PM

when you're done throwing your temper tantrum, please point out where I ever stated "he doesn't deserve any protection because he's part of the majority". Please - go find this amazing quote of mine.

In the meantime, why don't you cut back on talk of being so respected as you look like an immature child at the moment. Sit down. Take a breath. Read what I wrote without jumping to poor assumptions, and present a counterargument with some semblance of maturity.

EDIT: While you're at this whole "growing up" thing, why don't you put away the backwards curses - it's really unneded on these forums. No, you're not clever. No, it's not funny. Yes, you are just trying to use a tagline for attention. :rolleyes:
Yeah, and changing Tama Drummer to (S) TD in the quotes is cool.

As long as there are kids the same age as my cousins on this forum I'm not going to use the F word without reversing it. I'm not trying to make a catch phrase or anything. Also, I'm perfectly calm, no need to take a breath.

And I'm glad you proved my point further by contuing talking down to other members of this forum. Get off your high horse, you're no better than anyone here.

EDIT: Ah I see. Well, let's look at that then. Why is there not a national movement to dampen such horrid terms as "whitie"? BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT A MINORITY. Because you can't point to a single moment in American history where white straight upper middle class males were discriminated against (first person to say reverse discrimination dies, and misses the point). Because minority populations such as blacks, hispanics, gays, and even women were severely hurt. Wounds heal slowly and leave scars.

Right thur.

Serge

09-29-2006, 04:45 PM

uniquinous

09-29-2006, 04:53 PM

Yeah, and changing Tama Drummer to (S) TD in the quotes is cool.It... was a joke. I change everyone's names.[/quote]

As long as there are kids the same age as my cousins on this forum I'm not going to use the F word without reversing it. I'm not trying to make a catch phrase or anything. Also, I'm perfectly calm, no need to take a breath.First - breathing is generally a good thing to do. Just sayin. Second, reversing the order of the letters doesn't make it any less a curse. That's like people who won't type "fuck" but "f*ck" is somehow fine. Everyone knows what you're saying and how you're using that word! Heck most of the people will just read it "fuck" anyway.

And I'm glad you proved my point further by contuing talking down to other members of this forum.Actually your point claimed I stated majorities don't deserve protection. I haven't furthered your point at all. In fact, I've pretty much shot it down dead, seeing as you can't contonue backing it and completely ignored it in this last post of yours.

So, if you want to stick to the points, by all means: point out where I said majorities don't deserve rights, and we'll continue on with your ridiculous accusation.

uniquinous

09-29-2006, 04:54 PM

ah i see, you edited you post - but you still haven't pointed out where I stated majority members don't deserve rights. Why don't you highlight the exact line I said it. IF you don't mind.

I agree with you Achilles.

Serge

09-29-2006, 04:59 PM

Ah I see. Well, let's look at that then. Why is there not a national movement to dampen such horrid terms as "whitie"? BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT A MINORITY.

Right thur.

Serge

09-29-2006, 04:59 PM

I agree with you Achilles.

No you don't.

uniquinous

09-30-2006, 12:41 PM

Right thur.
No you don't.Yes, I assure you, I do. Now again, stop throwing your temper tantrum and try swallowing what I'm actually typing, not just what you want to see. Show me a single sentence where I stated I believe majorities are not deserving of rights. You can't. I asked you multiple times and at best you can present entire paragraphs, vague references, and not a single place I mention it. Give me a sentence - bold the exact words.

No, you can't. What i *DID* say however was that, while everyone's RIGHTS are the same, the CONSEQUENCES of those rights are unequal. If you didn't understood what that meant you should have asked instead of assuming it meant "majorities dont deserve rights". So what does that mean? Let me give you an example.

Let's say 5 white members of the KKK assemble on a street corner to preach their radical religion somewhere in the middle of a neighborhood whose residents are in proportion to the ethnicities of this country as a whole (that is, the majority are white, 12% hispanic, 12% black, etc). Now let's say we replace them with 5 Muslim radicals on that same street corner doing the same thing.

Both groups have the same RIGHTS: freedom of speech, freedom to peacefully assemble, etc. But look at the CONSEQUENCES of their actions. Most likely people will look down upon the KKK members but tolerate them, as attacking them would be unlawful (and indeed this is seen all the time). You think Americans wouldn't shred those muslim radicals limb from limb? How long you think it would be before the first stone was thrown?

The CONSEQUENCES of those rights are different. Example2: Men and women both have rights against being assaulted. If a man hits his wife over the head with a beer bottle, the CONSEQUENCES are much different then if the wife attacked the man with the beer bottle.

Why? Because the history and minority status of these people directly determines that. Discrimination against most minorities either 1) directly did harm to their lineages and creates problems for them today, or 2) directly gives problems for them today as discrimination still exists. Heck the LA police beat innocent minorities! Planted evidence!

So no, your point was ridiculous, made in a hissy fit because you don't like me. So again, I'll ask that you kindly stop talking about who's more respected on TAO as you make a fool of yourself with a ridiculous point.

--------------------------------

Think of it this way Serge. If you saw Achilles on the streets of Boston and went to go attack him with arms flailing, you KNOW he's gonna put you on your ass; quick, hard, effectively. Similarly, if you try to attack me intellectually in a similar flail because you're upset and you don't like me, I'm going to shoot down your attacks just the same.

However I would make a bet that if you went up to Achilles and asked to spar with him, he would respect you more, and you wouldn't be faced with such a hard take-down. The exact same is true for the intellectual fight as well. You wanna come at me like a child because I upset you somehow? Don't expect me to show you much respect. *THIS* is why you see me as so high: because I'm stepping on your back as you are on your hands and knees in the dirt. IF however you want to intellectually spar with me in a mature manner, such as Northwind, realist, Jeffery (heck evern 12 at times) do, then you'll find you won't be complaining so much about me being higher then you, as I'd show you MUCH more respect in my response.

Consider these things before you act next time.

Serge

09-30-2006, 04:00 PM

Do you get lonely up there on your pedestal lord eunoch?

Serge

09-30-2006, 04:10 PM

Wait, I'm sorry, only kids are allowed to be funny.

I'm being imature again.

I'll put it this way. This isn't really an "intellectual discussion". You're the one who set the tone by insulting Tama in your first post in this thread.

Also, you don't have me on my back in the dirt. I've been insanely happy from my first post in this thread all they way through to this one.

You say this:
Show me a single sentence where I stated I believe majorities are not deserving of rights. You can't. I asked you multiple times and at best you can present entire paragraphs, vague references, and not a single place I mention it. Give me a sentence - bold the exact words.

When it's actually you who is turning a blind eye to what people are actually saying in this thread. You're interpereting it how you want to interperet it. I'm sorry people made fun of you for being gay when you first came out. I really am. I would like you to know that I would never do something like that. However, I really doubt that gay people need you to stand over them holding a shield to protect them from the real world. In fact, if the stereotypes shown on television are true, gay people have some of the thickest skin on the planet.

Now, for the phrase "that's gay." I'm fairly certain this evolved from the phrase "that's queer." In which the word queer meant strange/odd and not homosexual. It's just a slight evolution of the american language. I know it probably was influenced by hate towards homosexuals, but most people don't mean it like that anymore, the phrase is harmless when being used to describe something other than a person.

Serge

09-30-2006, 04:13 PM

And the reason I don't like you, eunoch. Stems _entirely_ from the tone you use. You. Are. A. Dick.

I thought this before I ever had a single discussion with you. It is completely evident in any post you make that is longer than one or two sentences.

meat.eater

09-30-2006, 08:18 PM

It doesnt make it harmless, it makes it completely diluted.

Ächilles

09-30-2006, 11:01 PM

I think that the world should have a gay hemisphere, and a straight hemisphere, and every five years they can clash in an Olympic style tournament of champions.

I'm not really sure how that solves anything, but it'd be pretty rad.

Jeffery

09-30-2006, 11:05 PM

Punishment

09-30-2006, 11:11 PM

As Achilles team mate you should be happy for him. Don't be jealous at his superior athletic and physical skills. I'm sure you're a good person.. on the inside.

uniquinous

09-30-2006, 11:13 PM

Triple post and name calling? Well, my little pedastool, when you're ready to get out of the mud I'd be happy to step off your back. Until then I'll continue examining the very few actual points you make.

I'm sorry people made fun of you for being gay when you first came out. I really am. I would like you to know that I would never do something like that.Actually, you just did. Do you not realize how ironic your sarcasm is? This made me laugh, a lot.

However, I really doubt that gay people need you to stand over them holding a shield to protect them from the real world. In fact, if the stereotypes shown on television are true, gay people have some of the thickest skin on the planet.Ah I see... you're using TV as your reference to define all gay people around the world... You're the type of pubescent moron who uses playboy and cosmo to figure out what "girls want", don't you? :huh: TV, eh?

The fact is, historically minorities have, in exact opposition to your claim there, needed the support of the majority group in order to overcome their discrimination. What do you think the civil war was about silly boy? Oh I'm sorry, they don't explain that too often on TV perhaps you don't know?

Now, for the phrase "that's gay." I'm fairly certain this evolved from the phrase "that's queer." In which the word queer meant strange/odd and not homosexual.I think every single person in this thread aside from you, including but not limited to Tama Drummer and dirka himself, agrees with me when I say that the evolution of term stemmed directly from "homosexual". What was debated was the sway that history has on the word's current meaning. Do you really not see the common thread between "queer" and "gay" as "homosexual"? REALLY?! I think you might have realized your mistake after you typed those phrases, as your next sentence states "I know it probably was influenced by hate towards homosexuals". Probably influenced?! :huh: REALLY!?

And the reason I don't like you, eunoch. Stems _entirely_ from the tone you use. You. Are. A. Dick.

I thought this before I ever had a single discussion with you. It is completely evident in any post you make that is longer than one or two sentences.Do you normally act like a brat anytime you meet someone who upset you due to tone? Is that how you deal with problems in life? You battle my tone with a temper tantrum?

So again I will ask, since you seem to be entirely avoiding the poorly constructed point you've previously made: Where did I ever claim minorities don't deserve rights?

I can point out where you directly insinuated that claim:if a group of black guys pick on a white kid and say stuff like, "You punk-ass little cracker, why don't you drive home in your daddy's car?" he doesn't deserve any protection because he's part of the majority? It's okay if he gets picked on because of his race because people of his race did mean things before this kid was even born?Now I interpretted that as you claiming I stated majorities don't deserve rights due to the bolded phrases. You wanna tell me my interpretation was wrong? Or you wanna withdraw your misinterpretation and the ridiculous claim you made? Or by all means continue trying to defend it with childish name calling. You gonna move onto "your momma" jokes soon? cuz I'ma break out the popcorn if you do...

Come on little boy - it's fun watching you flail helplessly.

Ächilles

09-30-2006, 11:14 PM

Yeah, but with you on their side the gays would always win......

If I was gay, I'd be able to dance.

I rue the day I was born a straight man. Whatever will I do come prom?

Sorry, Emily : (

Drunk With Hate

09-30-2006, 11:16 PM

Point and case have been established. Whom is founded in idiocy is obvious, being uniq. Nobody has taken his side and even people who he is fighting for are against him. How about we end the thread. Serge, be the bigger person, don't respond.

Punishment

09-30-2006, 11:24 PM

Triple post and name calling? Well, my little pedastool, when you're ready to get out of the mud I'd be happy to step off your back. Until then I'll continue examining the very few actual points you make.

Actually, you just did. Do you not realize how ironic your sarcasm is? This made me laugh, a lot.

Are you sure he is being sarcastic. He seems genuine to me..

Ah I see... you're using TV as your reference to define all gay people around the world... You're the type of pubescent moron who uses playboy and cosmo to figure out what "girls want", don't you? :huh: TV, eh?

The fact is, historically minorities have, in exact opposition to your claim there, needed the support of the majority group in order to overcome their discrimination. What do you think the civil war was about silly boy? Oh I'm sorry, they don't explain that too often on TV perhaps you don't know?

Uniq, I actually know a few gay people. In public they behave JUST LIKE OTHER PEOPLE. They aren't discrimated against, and they live perfectly normal lives. Are you saying that just because someone is gay they need your protection? They live perfectly well on their own without you standing up for them.

I think every single person in this thread aside from you, including but not limited to Tama Drummer and dirka himself, agrees with me when I say that the evolution of term stemmed directly from "homosexual". What was debated was the sway that history has on the word's current meaning. Do you really not see the common thread between "queer" and "gay" as "homosexual"? REALLY?! I think you might have realized your mistake after you typed those phrases, as your next sentence states "I know it probably was influenced by hate towards homosexuals". Probably influenced?! :huh: REALLY!?

Actually, I think the queer thing makes sense. Someone must have once associated "Queer" with homosexual. I don't know.

Do you normally act like a brat anytime you meet someone who upset you due to tone? Is that how you deal with problems in life? You battle my tone with a temper tantrum?

I'm not sure how you actually are uniq, but on these forums you do seem to be riding on a pretty high horse looking down on us. I can see how your manner can come off as annoying.

So again I will ask, since you seem to be entirely avoiding the poorly constructed point you've previously made: Where did I ever claim minorities don't deserve rights?

I can point out where you directly insinuated that claim:Now I interpretted that as you claiming I stated majorities don't deserve rights due to the bolded phrases. You wanna tell me my interpretation was wrong? Or you wanna withdraw your misinterpretation and the ridiculous claim you made? Or by all means continue trying to defend it with childish name calling. You gonna move onto "your momma" jokes soon? cuz I'ma break out the popcorn if you do...

Come on little boy - it's fun watching you flail helplessly.

You said that because they called me whitie I shouldn't be defended because I was part of the majority. If i'm insulted, I want the minorities standing up for me. If i'm expected to do the same for them, why should they not back me up :p

uniquinous

09-30-2006, 11:44 PM

Are you sure he is being sarcastic. He seems genuine to me.. I'm not gay, and have mentioned that, and that my motives behind my aggression are from seeing many personal friends hurt. So yes, I'd say him being "sorry" for me when I "came out" is sarcasm.

Uniq, I actually know a few gay people. In public they behave JUST LIKE OTHER PEOPLE. They aren't discrimated against, and they live perfectly normal lives. Are you saying that just because someone is gay they need your protection? They live perfectly well on their own without you standing up for them.No, I'm saying majority parties, especially when regarding government, MUST look out for the safety, well being, and rights of the minorities. This is prececisely why the american justice system uses consensus in their juries and not a voting system: to ensure even the minority voices are heard.

Actually, I think the queer thing makes sense. Someone must have once associated "Queer" with homosexual. I don't know.Yes, someone associated Queer with homosexual. However, no one associated "that's gay" from queer's original meaning of "odd" - it stemmed from homosexual. Order matters here.

I'm not sure how you actually are uniq, but on these forums you do seem to be riding on a pretty high horse looking down on us. I can see how your manner can come off as annoying.Yes, you're right Pun, and I'm noticing that more and more. Actually I wish you hadn't quoted that last post of mine as I came on to completely remove it and replace it with an appology. But, if other's have already seen it I'll just live with my arrogance exposed and take THIS space to accomplish the same goal.

Serge-

I appologize. Clearly there was a misunderstanding. You were upset, I was upset, things got out of hand. I shouldn't have antagonized you as I did. I still hold fast to the belief that you misunderstood what I was saying, and I do hope that I got the point across that I have never believed minorities are entitled to more/better rights then anyone else. Unfortunately I see in hindsight that my point came through in a very aggresive manner, and for that I am sorry.

You (and dirka) have no reason to stop disliking me just from one simple appology, but I will look to change the percieved tone of my posts in the future. I have no intention of competing with you or anyone else for the respect of this community, but I do hope to get my intellectual points across in an accepted and acceptable manner.

Sincerely,
~eunoch.

meat.eater

10-01-2006, 12:21 AM

The insult was not born from a notion of being "odd." Just realize that for many years, and still to this day (especially in young people), being homosexual is percieved as a bad thing. And it is used as an insult - mainly in.. gasp.. young people. Someone made "queer" into a [socially acceptable] term for gays when they had a brain shock informing them that homosexuals are, indeed, different. That man wasnt a genius, just a trend starter. And, yes, "eunoch" is right in the fact that the term is insulting to gays. Just if we started using "Serge" as a serious insult, you'd be hurt as well. But you have to take it for what it is: ignorance. You cant get so pissed off at someone for ignorance.

However, your statement of "gays having thick skin," from my experience, is very true. Arguments like this DONT NEED TO HAPPEN (especially between two people who arent actually personally insulted by it!)

Uni, I also said before that being overly sensitive alienate's homosexuals just as much as being insensitive. To many gays who simply search for attention (many do - it's lame) that's probably fine. But for peopel like myself, who just want to live my own freaking life and dont need other people tellign me when I should feel offended, its incredibly annoying. Also, as I said before, bless you for having the empathy to even feel this passionately about it, but shit... enough is enough.

Regarding minorities - they should be treated just as fairly as majorities. Which is for both arguments. Majorities should be treated fairly and so should minorities (but, fact of the matter is, they arent). So, what Uni is saying is to raise them to the same level (I think). With personal choice, I agree; with financial status, that's a different conversation.

Finally - yes, it's true that Uniquin comes off as a "dick," to quote Serge. Its somethign he should be aware of, also. But this crowd of people who just follow Uniquin and his belief's and automatically look for something he says to argue against, and good gracious there are a lot of you, are just as big "dick's" as he can be. There are so much better uses of time.

Yeah, people think differently. Dont use opinions as your arsenal, it just makes you start hating other people.

Its really sad, because everyone here agree's that the term "that's gay" isnt PC. Just the people who are slightly more immature dont really care. They understand that whatever "that" normally is doesnt actual have sexual desires for something of the same gender. :)

Seriously. Make-up sex. Tomorrow.

uniquinous

10-01-2006, 11:57 AM

I found an interesting article and statistics on this subject:

The essential difference between gay youth and youth from other minorities is that gay and lesbian youth do not grow up with people like themselves. The products of heterosexual families in the vast majority of cases, gay youth usually come from communities where few gay adults are visible, attend schools with no openly gay staff, and belong to friendship groups where anti-gay rhetoric is commonplace. Often feeling completely isolated, these youth must make a perilous journey to adulthood through a society, which provides them with a mostly negative stance regarding homosexuality.

According to the U.S. Department of Justice, "Homosexuals are probably the most frequent victims" of hate crimes.

The U.S. Department of Health & Human Services found that 28% of gay youth drop out of high school altogether, usually to escape the harassment, violence, and alienation they face at school. Often, gay youth feel so hopeless that ending their lives feels like the only solution to their problems. Up to 30% of completed teen suicides each year are by gay teens. That equals 1500 gay youth dying every year of suicide alone. This means that a gay youth tries to kill him or her self every thirty-five minutes in the United States, and that a gay youth succeeds in doing so every six hours. Overall, LGBT youth simply aren't given the opportunity to feel secure and supported as every child should.

http://www.youthone.com/volunteer/readstory.cfm?story_ID=7
http://www.geocities.com/youth4sa/homophobia.html
http://www.oasismag.com/node/view/651
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1589/is_2005_March_15/ai_n13629319
http://www.users.csbsju.edu/record/archives/2003-2004/03-25-04/opinion/homophobic_language_indicate.html

35 LGBT youths have comitted suicide since the start of this thread.

Drunk With Hate

10-01-2006, 12:16 PM

I'm moving your stupidity to PM as it's not needed publicly anymore.
The debate is long over. As I said, who would appear to be correct is obvious, and that isn't you. Take it to PM all you would like. I'll respond in the proper thread.

Point and case have been established. Whom is founded in idiocy is obvious, being uniq. Nobody has taken his side and even people who he is fighting for are against him. How about we end the thread. Serge, be the bigger person, don't respond.

You're good at saying stuff and not so good at backing it. All you have is one gay guy, meat, who has never cared even about outright gay bashing, who again says he doesn't care, and yet someone you take that to mean "even people who he is fighting for are against [me]". One apathetic guy means all gay people are against me? Are you really that stupid? Back your claim.
Where did I say _all_ gay people are against you? I infact said _even people_ which in no way means all or even implies such. You took it that way. Why? I don't know. Maybe you feel defeated. I honestly don't care. I'm just calling them like I see thems.

The fact of the matter is, if you took just 5 minutes to research the topic you would fina a long slew of articles and movements about this growing trend and how it is percieved as harmful to a large number of people. You can say it's not true all you want, but the people who are being hurt by it make you automatically wrong.
I've never said it isn't true. I've said that if people feel one word can be so offensive and so painful, then they need to die. Like meat has shown. You can't take words too seriously. They are words. Now if I said "I'm gonna go hang all the gay fags at my school" then there would be cause for alarm. I don't care if someone gets offended at the word gay. I get offended that they are offended and I am offended they stole the meaning of the word, I want to use it as merry and everytime it is used it means gay.

It shows the world that "gay" is synonymous with "wrong" and "bad." It sends a clear message to GLBTQ students that their sexual orientation is unacceptable and that they are not welcome
I do believe I've already touched on that and agreed.

Comments like "fag," "dyke," and "that's gay" are used so regularly in high schools that few even notice such hateful language as being anything out of the ordinary. According to a survey conducted, 97% of students at one suburban high school had heard homophobic language used in school.

The U.S. Department of Health & Human Services found that 28% of gay youth drop out of high school altogether, usually to escape the harassment, violence, and alienation they face at school.

1500 gay youth dying every year of suicide alone. This means that a gay youth tries to kill him or her self every thirty-five minutes in the United States, and that a gay youth succeeds in doing so every six hours.
You still wanna tell me "it doesn't matter"?
Yes. It doesn't matter. Tons of people drop out for many reasons.

Drunk With Hate

10-01-2006, 12:19 PM

Uniquinous.

Your thread on why you hate our troops clearly shows you find large deaths unimportant, and it shouldn't be talked about or mourned for years after.

Same with gays commiting suicide, same with any suicide, same with your suicide, if you don't care why do you expect us to.

uniquinous

10-01-2006, 12:23 PM

But this crowd of people who just follow Uniquin and his belief's and automatically look for something he says to argue against, and good gracious there are a lot of you, are just as big "dick's" as he can be.

if people feel one word can be so offensive and so painful, then they need to die.

Serge, be the bigger person, don't respond.
:rolleyes:

meat.eater

10-01-2006, 12:26 PM

And I'm sure the ratio of gay LGBT suicides to LGBT population is smaller than straight suicide to straight population. If fact, I know it.

Having thick skin is part of it. Ideally, they wouldnt have to have thick skin, which I know is the morality part of this that angers you, Uni. But thats not how the world is right now.

Drunk With Hate

10-01-2006, 12:27 PM

:rolleyes:

I never said I wouldn't respond. I clearly love to argue, petty or not. So, respond, or are you finally going to hang up your coat, lord knows it is time.

Punishment

10-01-2006, 01:02 PM

I found an interesting article and statistics on this subject:

The essential difference between gay youth and youth from other minorities is that gay and lesbian youth do not grow up with people like themselves. The products of heterosexual families in the vast majority of cases, gay youth usually come from communities where few gay adults are visible, attend schools with no openly gay staff, and belong to friendship groups where anti-gay rhetoric is commonplace. Often feeling completely isolated, these youth must make a perilous journey to adulthood through a society, which provides them with a mostly negative stance regarding homosexuality.

According to the U.S. Department of Justice, "Homosexuals are probably the most frequent victims" of hate crimes.

The U.S. Department of Health & Human Services found that 28% of gay youth drop out of high school altogether, usually to escape the harassment, violence, and alienation they face at school. Often, gay youth feel so hopeless that ending their lives feels like the only solution to their problems. Up to 30% of completed teen suicides each year are by gay teens. That equals 1500 gay youth dying every year of suicide alone. This means that a gay youth tries to kill him or her self every thirty-five minutes in the United States, and that a gay youth succeeds in doing so every six hours. Overall, LGBT youth simply aren't given the opportunity to feel secure and supported as every child should.

Ok, few things I'm curious about.

1. What percentage of ALL students drop out of high school? 28% of the gay youth seems like a lot. How many of those dropouts earn their GED and go to community college or something early.

2. 1500 gay youth per year die of suicide, and only about 1/12 is successful. How many of those are a true attempt at suicide, and not just a plea for attention? If someone really wanted to kill themselves, I'm sure there is a better way than slitting your wrist with a butter knife.

http://www.youthone.com/volunteer/readstory.cfm?story_ID=7
http://www.geocities.com/youth4sa/homophobia.html
http://www.oasismag.com/node/view/651
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1589/is_2005_March_15/ai_n13629319
http://www.users.csbsju.edu/record/archives/2003-2004/03-25-04/opinion/homophobic_language_indicate.html

35 LGBT youths have comitted suicide since the start of this thread.

35 people really is nothing. Since i started writing this post, at least double that many have died from smoking/ heart failure probably.

uniquinous

10-01-2006, 01:08 PM

Very good comparison and interesting way or putting it in perspective. My only differentiation would be that these people are killing themselves voluntarily. However, it's 30% of all teen suicides. ~1/3. Successful. 30% of all teens are not in this population. Estimates show 3-10% (arguably). So I'd say, at BEST, gay teens are 3 times more likely to kill themselves compared to their straight counterparts. At WORST, 10 times more likely.

I look into your first point as it could turn up VERY valid and either edit or make a new post.

EDIT: 1993 dropout rates:
7.9 percent for white students, compared to 13.6 percent for black students and 27.5 percent for Hispanic students; and
2.7 percent for students with a high family income level, compared to 23.9 percent for students with a low family income level.

So I'd say the 28% puts them at par of low income or hispanic students.

EDIT II:
http://www.childtrendsdatabank.org/figures/1-figure-1.gif

This graph suggests that today, the population most likely to drop out of high school are LGBT teens, more then any other demographic.

And I'm sure the ratio of gay LGBT suicides to LGBT population is smaller than straight suicide to straight population. If fact, I know it.The statistics suggest otherwise.

meat.eater

10-01-2006, 01:12 PM

Now this is becoming teh 9/11 thread talkign about death numbers. Who cares? Liek I said before - we all pretty much agree, so stop searching for something to argue about. Its annoying and it makes you look stupid.

Redundancy blows.

KickAssPlaya

10-01-2006, 01:16 PM

uniquinous

10-01-2006, 01:18 PM

Now this is becoming teh 9/11 thread talkign about death numbers. Who cares? Liek I said before - we all pretty much agreeActually, we don't. Please go read the last edit of my previous post - you were wrong about that "thick skin" thing.

Serge

10-01-2006, 04:22 PM

I find the title of this thread to be hillarious.

Alaric

10-02-2006, 11:26 AM

I go to a school run bu thugs, aka niggas. I am a minority, and yet I am white. So me and the other whities made a gang of whities. (battleing ingnorance and hate with more ignorance and hate.) Anyway, I didnt really have a point, just thought I would say

Umm. WHITE POWA!
/slinks away

uniquinous

10-02-2006, 12:27 PM

wow...

Cuathon

10-02-2006, 01:38 PM

white kids are a minority at my school. we get picked on for it too. they say all this shit and stuff but if we respond its like we called them a bunch of fat stupid niggers. on a note, we dont say anything like that, but it is treateed as if we had.

Drunk With Hate

10-02-2006, 02:00 PM

It is amazing at how stupid uniq and select other people can be.

Alaric

10-02-2006, 03:08 PM

Ok, I had more, but the bell rang. So now here is the whole story( i will try not to egvagerat). In freshman year I got jumped alot for being a "uppity cracker". So i fought back, but numbers prevented me from ever winning. So I got fed up and met with some nazis from a neigboring school. They agreed to form a white only gang. We started to jump niggas and before long, people new who I was. After that, (junior year) alot of whities came to us for protection, an we grew very large. We were white rags from our pockets to signify. Soom nggas still fight, but most have givin up. Now, I dont really hate all black people, but niggas make me sick. In the early days, there we lots of jumpings, on both sides. As well as stabbings. No guns yet.

uniquinous

10-02-2006, 03:15 PM

It is amazing at how stupid uniq and select other people can be.Oh do tell us about the other select few and how we are being stupid this time! :)

Ok, I had more, but the bell rang. So now here is the whole story( i will try not to egvagerat). In freshman year I got jumped alot for being a "uppity cracker". So i fought back, but numbers prevented me from ever winning. So I got fed up and met with some nazis from a neigboring school. They agreed to form a white only gang. We started to jump niggas and before long, people new who I was. After that, (junior year) alot of whities came to us for protection, an we grew very large. We were white rags from our pockets to signify. Soom nggas still fight, but most have givin up. Now, I dont really hate all black people, but niggas make me sick. In the early days, there we lots of jumpings, on both sides. As well as stabbings. No guns yet.
Who ARE you? More importantly... when do you break out with the hardcore ballet and overdone love-story of starcrossed lovers that society wouldn't let be together? :huh:

http://www.oscars.org/press/pressreleases/images/021230.jpg
"When you're a noob you're a noob all the way..."

Drunk With Hate

10-02-2006, 03:17 PM

Oh do tell us about the other select few and how we are being stupid this time! :)

Everybody who has posted here so far has contributed. You were just the catalyst.

sayter

10-02-2006, 03:18 PM

No, uni is right. It has become a common slang nowadays, and its ridiculous. It started in the first place due to idiotic teenagers using sexuality as an insult on others and from there just kind of took off.

For the record: Gay means happy. Faggot is a bundle of sticks tied together with a piece of string, and Fag is a cigarrete.

We all do it from time to time I am sure, but it should be removed from our vocabulary if at all possible. It sounds bigoted and idiotic from anyones mouth regardless of how it was intended.

Those who argue this fact are often teenagers who are far more "exposed" to it than adults, or are simply idiots who don't know any better.

If he wanted to say That's Lame, he should have said Thats Lame.

sayter

10-02-2006, 03:51 PM

.MIND.: A very special place in my heart is now reserved for you, where you are burning for all eternity in the hell that your "God" has reserved for you and bigoted like-minded people. I thought judgement was for him, and him alone hmm? Anyone who says gay is a "choice" is , simply put, a useless waste of skin. I don't care what your "good book" says, or what preachers or fundamentalists say. They "choose" to believe that this is the truth, despite a huge heap of evidence to the contrary. Using your own argument against you.... beasts supposedly do not "choose", they act only as they are apt to, for they do not have souls and are mere animals right?

Then why are Bonobo apes and penguins both shown to have gay members in their family groups? This is not made up. It is fact. There are undoubtedly other animals which share this facet of NATURAL gender-choice selection. We are one of them. Some folks liek the opposite sex. some like the same sex. Some like both. If it was strictly natural to love the opposite sex and no other, we would not develop an affinity for those of the same gender and thus homosexuality would not even exist.
However, it has existed since the dawn of our species, and is hardly a new occurance. In SOME cases, people "choose" to have sex with their own gender. This is strictly on a forced basis, however. Prison is a prime example. You want sex. You can only have it with men. Some sex is better than no sex. Thus, I, the inmate, choose to ream Bubba in the cornhole. That does not imply that I, the inmate, have TURNED gay, only that I resorted to what I had to in order to satiate my base desires.

Yes yes, I hear you already "I still haven't seen proof"....genetic research doesn't happen overnight. Your faith tells you that homosexuality is wrong. That is fine. But to make a grandiose assumption about an entire facet of human civiliztion makes you no better than a nazi. Period. Hitler said all jews were evil, and sub-human and thus, killing them was a moral NEED for the nazi party and for the good of humanity. Much like countless other evil crusades throughout history. There is always some false moral reasoning (usually religious) behind them. Like it or not, homosexuality it is not a choice, and even if it was it would certainly not be a choice in the way we commonly look at it. Uni's post regarding Love as a choice is a fine example of this.

For most of my youth I was 100% sure I was straight. Then, when I turned 19 I met a wonderful girl who became a close friend. Things grew from there and I had serious feelings for her. Out of the blue. I did not CHOOSE to be bisexual. I ended up that way due to growing close to another of my gender and finding a sexual connection that I had not thought possible. The only choice I made in regards to that relationship was whether or not to pursue a sexual side to that relationship. My attraction to her was not a concious choice. And it isn't the sex that is "gay". It is the emotion behind it that is. Since then I have been bisexual by "choice" because I know that i already AM bisexual, and always was. Sometimes you just don't notice it until its' happening, and to deny if after that is simply stupid. I then realised that a lot of times throughout my life I had considered it, however briefly, as a possibility of my character. Until I had feelings for someone of the same gender, however, I didn't understand what it really was. Once I did, I never looked back and I am a better person because of it.

This is why I loathe organised religion in almost all its' countless forms. It encourages the derailment of decency in favor of strict and idiotic bigotry. It inspires unthinkable violence and mistreatment of those outside of the group, and drags the very concept of humanity through the dirt and then defecates on it before cutting off its' head.

Were it not so hysterically funny that people would deny themselves the very things god gave them as a gift (reason, choice, etc) as he made them in his image, I might feel sorry for all the fanatics out there.

Oh, and just for fun, MIND: Why is homosexuality wrong. Give me reasons, WITHOUT using the bible or any religious teachings you have ever been taught as reference. And no, "we can only breed with a male and female" is not a viable reason. Humans have sex for fun and pleasure, not just to breed.

Oh and another fun fact. They did a scientific study a few years back and discovered that those who are the most homophobic are vastly more likely to be homosexuals themselves. Im sure you can find it somewhere over google if you feel compelled to check up on it. Maybe its time for some personal reflection on your sexuality ?

uniquinous

10-02-2006, 03:52 PM

Everybody who has posted here so far has contributed. You were just the catalyst.So by "select few" you meant 'everyone in this thread including yourself (dirka)'? Oh I see now

If he wanted to say That's Lame, he should have said Thats Lame.this is why you rock ;)

Drunk With Hate

10-02-2006, 03:57 PM

So by "select few" you meant 'everyone in this thread including yourself (dirka)'? Oh I see now

Yes... considering a select few would be about.. most of this thread and I did post, did I not? What is so hard to understand?

Alaric

10-02-2006, 03:57 PM

when do you break out with the hardcore ballet and overdone love-story of starcrossed lovers that society wouldn't let be together? :huh:

http://www.oscars.org/press/pressreleases/images/021230.jpg
"When you're a noob you're a noob all the way..."

Some were in the middle. btw, it was really hard to shug that off, but if you a nig, then I understand your reasons for posting( I mean other than being an ass like all your other posts).

sayter

10-02-2006, 04:06 PM

I do it for you, uni baby :)

Tama Drummer

10-02-2006, 04:15 PM

I didn't say, "that's lame," because the word "lame" is lame.

Wizzy`

10-02-2006, 04:19 PM

I didn't say, "that's lame," because the word "lame" is lame.

That's so homosexual.

sayter

10-02-2006, 04:34 PM

nah, its so LESBIAN

uniquinous

10-02-2006, 05:27 PM

Some were in the middle. btw, it was really hard to shug that off, but if you a nig, then I understand your reasons for posting( I mean other than being an ass like all your other posts).

So, in your own words, what exactly makes someone "a nig"?

sayter

10-02-2006, 06:48 PM

here we go again....this should be moved to General, mods. this is no longer anywhere CLOSE to a bug thread.

Alaric

10-03-2006, 10:26 AM

So, in your own words, what exactly makes someone "a nig"?

A nig is someone who thinks it is cool to hate and be ignorant.

uniquinous

10-03-2006, 10:49 AM

by that definition it sounds like you're a "nig" yourself then...

sayter

10-03-2006, 11:08 AM

aye, as one could assume that "nig" is derived from "nigger", and as I have never heard the expression before I believe it is a negative connotation in general perhaps invented by one named Alaric. If this is not the case, prove me wrong Alaric or you might just be branded a racist

Alaric

10-03-2006, 02:46 PM

A racist? possible. A nig? Umm no. Though I have hated, I dont drag down others. Though I am ignorant, I dont try to make ignorance socially acceptable.

uniquinous

10-03-2006, 03:35 PM

how do you hate and not allow it to affect others? how does your ignorance not automatically and tacitly show your social acceptance of it?

Alaric

10-03-2006, 04:02 PM

Punishment

10-03-2006, 04:05 PM

Bleh,

You guys are all fools.

Uniq, he can be as anti gay/black as he wants. It's his decision to make, not yours. Just respect it and move on. I doubt anyone is going to change their mind on an issue over an online argument with a bunch of tao nerds, so arguing for 200 responses is just pointless and a waste of time.

As for sayter. I don't know if becoming gay is a choice, and I don't care. You can say that it was in you your whole life, but it doesn't really prove anything one way or the other. There is no way to test if you are born with gay tendencies because you can't really take away babies and test them from the time they're born.

As I've said before about the issue with gays, I don't care if you're gay, just don't make a big deal of it. Sort of a don't ask don't tell policy, i guess :p, although, from another stand point, if two males were meant to be together, there would be some way to reproduce for that is the MAIN function of sex when you get down to it. Sure it can be for enjoyment, and whatever pleases you is good...

Alaric

10-03-2006, 04:22 PM

Ok, so like I am done with this thread. but before I am of, I wanna say two things. First, I AM racist, if you consider the ignorant a race. Second, a lot of things in this thread have made me lose a lot of respect for you uni. No, not your sticking up for people, just your assertiveness in your beliefs. However, I hope we don't become enemys. Some of what you said I strongly agree with(in particular the homosexual comments). I hope you also understand that I am the minority. I am a homosexual German Male. And that I ha dealt with plenty of dscrimination from the majority. Which are niggas.

ps: the thick skinned gay thing I think is true to a certain point.
pss: I say thats gay all the time.

sayter

10-03-2006, 06:43 PM

Totally agree Puni. All I was saying is that I nver "chose" to be it. Thus making MIND's point invalid, essentially. It cant be proven conclusively, but it cant be DISPROVEN either. Thus MIND saying "this is how it is" is idiotic, especially when his only basiss for argument is a preacher and a book written over a thousand years ago by numerous people without any proof, from which countless gospels were removed because they conflicted with "popular opinion" on the faith.

uniquinous

10-03-2006, 09:07 PM

Hate is an emotion, not an action. Just becuase I am ignorant doenst mean am not trying all the time to remidy it. Do I accept my ignorance? No. Do I accept others' ignorance? No. Why? Becuase ignorance is not acceptable, not so long as one has the ability to try and change it. Niggas dont try to escape ignorance. They bask in it.Hate is an emotion, but one not so easily hidden. So yes, 99.9%+ of the time, if you hate someone/thing, it's gonna show in some of your actions or reactions. OK it's great that you say you are trying to remedy your ignorance, but might I ask what you've done to accomplish that thusfar? I'd be very interested in your response.

Uniq, he can be as anti gay/black as he wants. It's his decision to make, not yours. Just respect it and move on. I doubt anyone is going to change their mind on an issue over an online argument with a bunch of tao nerds, so arguing for 200 responses is just pointless and a waste of time.:dry: Pun, you're coming onto an online gaming community forum and accusing me of wasting time? Are you serious? All due respect, you might wanna rescind the finger pointing on that one. The fact is, people change their minds every day, all the time. No, this alone will never do it. However, social stearing does occur, slowly, over time, from multiple sources.

As for sayter. I don't know if becoming gay is a choice, and I don't care.It's not. I've not found a single person that chose their sexuality. Ever. Ask around. Did you choose to be heterosexual?

As I've said before about the issue with gays, I don't care if you're gay, just don't make a big deal of it. Sort of a don't ask don't tell policy, i guess :pThis doesn't work though. Everytime someone says "look at that chick isn't she hot?" he's asking. In this society, such a sentiment doesn't exist. "I don't care if you're gay, just don't do it in front of me. Actually, don't be doin nothin behind me either... maybe... off to the side or something". heh

First, I AM racist, if you consider the ignorant a race.And you still claim yourself as ignorant. Are you... racist... against... yourself? :huh: I think thusfar you've shown me that the "nigs" you don't like are *mean* people, but how are they ignorant? Do they grossly generalize and stereotypically address white people? I would greatly like you to elaborate on this.

Second, a lot of things in this thread have made me lose a lot of respect for you uni. No, not your sticking up for people, just your assertiveness in your beliefs.Beliefs are all we got in this world. For the record though, the beliefs I've expressed many times aren't mine. Many times they are statistics, organizations, movement mission statements. Yes I can be assertive, but I hope you see (especially after my appology), that what I presented was factual - not assertively opinionated but rather educational/insightful.

However, I hope we don't become enemys. Some of what you said I strongly agree with(in particular the homosexual comments). I hope you also understand that I am the minority. I am a homosexual German Male. And that I ha dealt with plenty of dscrimination from the majority. Which are niggas.I can tell you the #1 reason we wouldn't become enemies is because you acknowledge your own viewpoint and state how you're trying to change it. It makes me... happy, in a way. The fact that you are a majority-minority makes your case particularly interesting, which is why I'm sad to see you be done with this thread. You could offer a very unique perspective on the flipside of the common viewpoint of these issues. I'm adding you to my list of "things will never know about" right up there with 'number of licks it takes to get to the center of a tootsie pop' and 'why dirka looks at himself in the mirror so much'. the world will never know...

Punishment

10-03-2006, 09:18 PM

:dry: Pun, you're coming onto an online gaming community forum and accusing me of wasting time? Are you serious? All due respect, you might wanna rescind the finger pointing on that one. The fact is, people change their minds every day, all the time. No, this alone will never do it. However, social stearing does occur, slowly, over time, from multiple sources.

I'm a HUGE time waster. If I had things to fill my day, I'd never be here again :D, however, as I am now, I have school, a job, few friends, and plenty of time for TAO forums. I think this particular thread is a waste, as there is no way that mind or alaric are going to change their minds.

(Sorry for the shitty grammar in this post. I'm damn tired, and my brain hurts) :p

It's not. I've not found a single person that chose their sexuality. Ever. Ask around. Did you choose to be heterosexual?

Hard to say. I've never really been exposed to gay people before high school (and by this time I'd already had a girlfriend or two, and thought that it was just the correct thing to do) . My parents don't have any gay friends (Not because they don't like them, just because they don't know any). I sort of think of it as a choice though, and a choice that was sort of made for you. A lot of younger kids have the "Eww girls" attitude. However, growing up, they see their parents, and all of their friends parents together, 1 man and 1 woman in most cases, and I guess that is why they 'choose' to be straight. I, like most kindergardeners had the "eww girls" attitude once, but by 2-3 grade I was a little ladies man ;)

This doesn't work though. Everytime someone says "look at that chick isn't she hot?" he's asking. In this society, such a sentiment doesn't exist. "I don't care if you're gay, just don't do it in front of me. Actually, don't be doin nothin behind me either... maybe... off to the side or something". heh

I said Don't make a big deal about it, and not to completely hide it. I'm not going to ask if you're gay, but if i'm making someone uncomfortable with a discussion ,they can say they don't want to have it , or they don't "swing that way". I guess I misspoke with the don't ask don't tell thing. Meant something a little different :p

uniquinous

10-03-2006, 09:34 PM

Lemme just ask you Pun: have you ever:
1) smoked a cig
2) smoked pot
3) drank alcohol
4) cut classes
5) cheated on an exam.

(don't actually answer, i dont mean to pry into your private life)

Here's the point though:thought that it was just the correct thing to doNot doing any of the above is the "correct" thing to do. Do you always just do the correct thing? Heck you're a rebellious teenager (redundant I know)! I would worry about your mental health if you only did the *correct* thing. :p What I'm trying to say is, correctness never stops teenagers from doing *anything*.

Punishment

10-03-2006, 10:02 PM

Lemme just ask you Pun: have you ever:
1) smoked a cig
2) smoked pot
3) drank alcohol
4) cut classes
5) cheated on an exam.

(don't actually answer, i dont mean to pry into your private life)

Here's the point though:Not doing any of the above is the "correct" thing to do. Do you always just do the correct thing? Heck you're a rebellious teenager (redundant I know)! I would worry about your mental health if you only did the *correct* thing. :p What I'm trying to say is, correctness never stops teenagers from doing *anything*.

Hmm, so becoming gay is a rebellious teenage decision?
"Screw you dad! I'm not going to get married to a (female ) doctor and go to Harvard Law! I'm gonna go on a date with Steve! :p"
"Go to your room!"
"Yo Mama foo"

Naw, I duno. You're not prying, and I've done a few of those things. Although, I've never smoked a cigarrette ( My mom smokes), and I've actually never really drank alcohol.

Uniq, I'm not saying that being straight is the CORRECT thing to do. I'm saying that I've always been exposed to men and women being together from a young age. In my mind, it is the correct thing to do. Maybe if I grew up in a gay neighborhood as a child with gay parents I would be homosexual, however, as I've not experienced this, I will never know. I THINK it is the correct thing for ME to be with a woman.

To be honest Uniq and sayter, I too think it is a choice (to some extent), BUT I think it is heavily effected by outside influences. I don't know if there is any data to dispute or back me up in this, but I may look later if I get bored :p. Maybe it's a subconcious decision, :p. (We're learning all about this sort of stuff in sociology right now , about choices and stuff, but I don't really pay attention :p. I remember they were testing monkeys and stuff about what they'd be like with no outside influence, and what this one "Wild child" was like. (Some girl that was kept hostage in her house until she was about 13 years old with no human contact)

Anywho, maybe after next monday i'll have some more intelligent input :p

/edit

Wow, 5 ":p" smilies :p:p:p

uniquinous

10-03-2006, 10:15 PM

lol well Steve might be happy about that, but I was saying that teenagers generally aren't too strongly influenced on what's "correct", nor what they necessarily grow up with. I always find it funny how many psychiatrists kids turn out really messed up sociomentally.

Ancient greeks worked homosexuality right into the culture. Men would have wives at home, used for procreation, and then they would have (boy) apprentices they would teach and pass on their knowledge to in return for sexual favors.

That's right, all your favorite philosophers of the time were homosexual pedaphiles, and it was completely accepted. ;)

But yeah, get back to us on monday. I'd like to hear more of what you have to say.

Jeffery

10-03-2006, 10:57 PM

So, Uniq. Why are you racist against Feces?

Do you really think you are oh so much better than Shit?

uniquinous

10-04-2006, 08:31 AM

Naw dawg it aint like dat at all. I have a friend that poops. Even my dog poops. But I don't, so I don't understand how you filthy filthy people continue to live, but I'm not an anti-poopist. I aint ignant! I just think crapping is a choice, and as such sinful if you choose to do it.

---------------------------------------

Alternate response #1:
No I am no better then Feces - we are all equal in this world and the fact is Jeffery, neither myself nor you can say we are better then crap.

Alternate response #2:
What you deam "racism" is no more then a misguided and otherwise ignorant attempt at trying to prove my arrogance. However studies have shown that crap is indeed dumber, smellier, and uglier then the average American. I'm not saying it doesn't deserve any basic rights here, but let's face it: no one cares if we execute teh poops with lethal flushation.

There was also a study done in 2001 regarding the hostility of poop, thus proving how much better I am. I mean heck, mild amounts of stress or just eating the wrong things can make the crap very violent in some people. It is this violent that we shouldn't need to stand in this society. Let it be WIPED from the face of.... this planet.

*wipes dirka's face*

Alaric

10-04-2006, 09:56 AM

Hate is an emotion, but one not so easily hidden. So yes, 99.9%+ of the time, if you hate someone/thing, it's gonna show in some of your actions or reactions. OK it's great that you say you are trying to remedy your ignorance, but might I ask what you've done to accomplish that thusfar? I'd be very interested in your response.

And you still claim yourself as ignorant. Are you... racist... against... yourself? :huh: I think thusfar you've shown me that the "nigs" you don't like are *mean* people, but how are they ignorant? Do they grossly generalize and stereotypically address white people? I would greatly like you to elaborate on this.

My hate is concealed pretty well, but yeah, not perfectly. To remidy ignorance? Lets see... I got to school, I study, I read becuase I enjoy it, in fact I enjoy learning period. When I say I am ignorant, I say it purely to be humble. And again, I dont hate ignorant people, just the people who refuse to change. I relize I may have written that somewere. O well. Do they grossly .... white people? Yes and no. They dont really use stereo types, but that doesnt stop there *meanness*. And they do have gay stereotypes. Are mean people niggas? No. Are niggas *mean*? Yes. I didnt plan on righting back, but you asked so I hope this helped a little.

Ok ,I thought of some more. First, white people can be niggas too(or wiggas if you prefer). I dont like them either. Not all black people are niggas, either. Anyone of any race can be a nigga. Nigga is a collection or dumbasses that have overly embrace "black" culture. The quotations means that actual black people dont like being associated with niggas(from my experiance anyway).

My hate is not seeded from me being gay or being picked on. It comes from, well, ignorance. Why do I hate ingorance so? Not entirely sure. But it turns my stomach inside out every time a hear a group of noisy niggas talking in ebonics. This is the next generation? God help us all. (I dont like organized religion, unless it is conveinent)