I need an Explanation.

[Terps rock]

Can Some one explain why I got kicked for not giving my opponent a draw?

[Drunk With Hate]

Uniq did it if it is unjust.

[bludhoundz]

I can explain.

mantis33 showed me a screenshot of you agreeing to a no dsm game and them bombing him. If one can prove that you broke the rules that you agreed to, I'd think it were a bannable offense. I was asking mantis to make it very clear to you, but I guess you just weren't taking it in. I asked him to give you an option, because you might not have known better, but you turned it down.

[mantis33]

Can Some one explain why I got kicked for not giving my opponent a draw?

Let's see...

How about because we agreed to a no dsm game and you all-out rush/bombed me?

I asked you numerous times if you would draw an rematch, you declined.

I told you numerous times that if you didn't draw and rematch, you would be kicked. You still declined. Does that cover it genius?

[Terps rock]

Well, the story:
*Spooky Wind*
Ok, I was waiting for a game... Mantis then pops in and says something like " Terps, I'll play you, but no dsm?"
I am like sure...
Then he jumps me.
At this point I still had dsm's in my set.
I was going to change sets.
He then he whines for awhile... asking me to draw. I said no just play and I rematch you.
He whines some more and refuses to move just passes his turns... Then gets a mod to boot me, for not drawing.

AND by the way you RUSHED ME... My pieces were there by for yours :P

[stryker]

You really ought not to have made this thread terps. You're just digging a hole.

[mantis33]

Well, the story:
*Spooky Wind*
Ok, I was waiting for a game... Mantis then pops in and says something like " Terps, I'll play you, but no dsm?"
I am like sure...
Then he jumps me.
At this point I still had dsm's in my set.
I was going to change sets.
He then he whines for awhile... asking me to draw. I said no just play and I rematch you.
He whines some more and refuses to move just passes his turns... Then gets a mod to boot me, for not drawing.

AND by the way you RUSHED ME... My pieces were there by for yours :P

I understand that, but that doesn't take away from the fact that you could have just drew and rematched me. And yes, I rushed you... so what? Did I use a dsm? No.

[bludhoundz]

Hm, I probably shouldn't have booted you then.

The following is not accusing anyone:

It would have been nice had mantis told me that he jumped you right at that moment, but he probably thought you had a setup without dsm in it. It also would have been nice if you told him you were going to change sets or taken your piece off the board before telling him sure.

However, since I'm at fault for not knowing all the information before acting upon it, I'll take responsibility.

[Jeffery]

Booting for something like that seems to be taking thins a bit far.

Booting should be reserved for offenses against the game, not just because one person is upset everything in the world is not exactly how they think it should be.

[Terps rock]

Is there anyway to one let me back on the server... and 2 lower Mantis's stats don't care about mine... Would have lost them soon anyway... Lets say I am a piece of metal that has been out in the rain for months.

[Terps rock]

You really ought not to have made this thread terps. You're just digging a hole.

Well seeing as I didn't know who booted me... This was the only way I could discuss the topic. You really ought not to have posted here. Your just being an ignorant waste of space :).

[stryker]

*frown* how true *leaves thread*

[bludhoundz]

Booting for something like that seems to be taking thins a bit far.

Booting should be reserved for offenses against the game, not just because one person is upset everything in the world is not exactly how they think it should be.

I'd think that choosing to cheat someone of rules they agreed to is bannable. It's basically trying to boost their stats (but without playing themself). It's pretty dishonorable. I guess it might be taking it a bit far, but it's never been discussed. If you guys want to tell me your opinions on it, I'll keep them in mind.

Terps, I don't think mantis' stats are a big issue here, but it would be possible to relower them. And I don't think you'll be able to log on to rev for 3 hours.. I'm sorry about that.

[mantis33]

Well seeing as I didn't know who booted me... This was the only way I could discuss the topic. You really ought not to have posted here. Your just being an ignorant waste of space :).

I told you Bludz was going to boot you. And as for the stats, I don't care if you put mine back were they were and put yours back where they were, because that's essentially what I wanted in the first place, a draw then rematch. :dry:

[Punishment]

That's dumb.

The game is freestyle, and I don't know anywhere in the rules that set cheating is illegal.

The DSM is such a weak unit anyways.. it dies after getting 1 good attack in. Why does everyone hate it? If you really dislike it.. just put in a central LWard.

Hmm, so Mantis jumped you... did you challenge him before or after he said no dsm? I've had peopel do similar stuff to me too. I challenge them, and then they say no dsm no ga no stone or something... I think it is the person who challenges call on the rules . If i challenge someone, i don't need to talk to them in the lobby. The game is freestyle unless I say differnetly :p

[Terps rock]

Psh... Its ok... Even though I rarely play and its sad that when I want to I can't. But its cool.

But yeah putting mantis back down to 1121 would make my day, because he just sat there and refused to even play...

[Terps rock]

I told you Bludz was going to boot you. And as for the stats, I don't care if you put mine back were they were and put yours back where they were, because that's essentially what I wanted in the first place, a draw then rematch. :dry:

a draw drops me three points!

[Drunk With Hate]

This is a perfect example of why Uniq shouldn't be a mod.

Anyway, shit happens, gotta set precidence somewhere - and it would appear this will. Not your fault, bludhoundz.

[mantis33]

a draw drops me three points!

OMFG, not 3 points?!?!??!?!??!?!

Anyway, I just took a hit to lower me yo 1120, 1 stat lower than wha I started from. Happy? :p

[Jeffery]

I'd think that choosing to cheat someone of rules they agreed to is bannable. It's basically trying to boost their stats (but without playing themself). It's pretty dishonorable. I guess it might be taking it a bit far, but it's never been discussed. If you guys want to tell me your opinions on it, I'll keep them in mind.

Terps, I don't think mantis' stats are a big issue here, but it would be possible to relower them. And I don't think you'll be able to log on to rev for 3 hours.. I'm sorry about that.
But in this case there was no intent to cheat. You took partial information from one players point of view, and used that to ban a player from a server.

Kicking is a punishment that should be reserved for those cases where there is NO doubt what has happened. In this case you even admitted you didn;t know what really happen, but god damnit, you kick people anyways.

Instead of making sure you had all the information, and there really was someone trying to cheat people, you instead decided to kick a player just because you could,

[Terps rock]

OMFG, not 3 points?!?!??!?!??!?!

Anyway, I just took a hit to lower me yo 1120, 1 stat lower than wha I started from. Happy? :p

:)

[***Duo***]

I can see this debate going either way.

There is no official "rule" about agreeing to a setup, and then going against your word.
It is immoral, and won't give you a good reputation, but it's not "officially" cheating--you don't have any obligation to tell the truth, or to trust what someone says.

On the other hand, I can see this as cheating because you can purposely do this to help raise your stats.

I really don't know which way to side with. Sometimes, these little plans backfire, (agreeing to a set and then going against your word) in which case, life is sweet.


-Duo

[bludhoundz]

I was asking mantis as much as I could think of about the situation. Yes, I realize, I didn't get full information in the end (because I couldn't really think of any information I didn't have), and I'm taking responsibility for my actions.

I WAS WRONG.

[Terps rock]

I was asking mantis as much as I could think of about the situation. Yes, I realize, I didn't get full information in the end (because I couldn't really think of any information I didn't have), and I'm taking responsibility for my actions.

I WAS WRONG.

But now I can't play! :crybaby:

[***Duo***]

But now I can't play! :crybaby:

Maybe he can let you play on a dummy account?


-Duo

[Soda]

But I can.

[bludhoundz]

Maybe he can let you play on a dummy account?


-Duo

Eh, I don't think I could. The dummies get wiped, like greys, so it would be an infinite stat source, which is what rev is all NOT about. Also, all the dummies have the same password.

And Terps, yet again, I'm sorry for this little episode.

[Anarchy_United]

I was asking mantis as much as I could think of about the situation. Yes, I realize, I didn't get full information in the end (because I couldn't really think of any information I didn't have), and I'm taking responsibility for my actions.

I WAS WRONG.
Hmmm, both the Pope and a Modly admitting they were wrong in the same year... I'm afraid the world is going to implode.

[meat.eater]

To me, "scamming" is trying to make your opponent do something that will jeapordise their account or its status or activity. IE: password trickery, "press f5", etc.

Agreeing to a form and using a different one is unsportsmanlike and disrespectful, but not worth a ban, ever, in my eyes.

[uniquinous]

depends on the situation for me. A lot of things aren't specified in the rules - that's why there are mods who need to use common sense. If I hear of a player routinely going around and tricking other players into matches that would unfairly put them at a disadvantage, I would take action.

Mantis in this case wanted stats to be minimally changed and then play a real game. That's not only reasonable, but fair. If you agree to a particular kind of match, it's your responsibility to click the little button called "SETTINGS" (it takes a whole 5 seconds) and ensure you are playing according to the rules set. Saying "I didn't realize" is never a valid excuse for breaching ANY rule/agreement, ever.

This player requested a draw - which is fair. The mod's job is to keep things fair. While this is an iffy situation, I will say that there are many reasons to kick for purposely tricking another player.

EDIT: mantis's stats were lowered - all are happy (cept for terps not getting on server), right?

[meat.eater]

EDIT - weird... long lag

[mantis33]

EDIT - weird... long lag

:confused:

And yes uniq, I'm pretty sure everything is settled now.

Except for the whole Final_Flash thing. ;) You mods need to definately look into that, I already failed one attempt at getting a player banned because of a "lack of evidence", that certainly cannot be the case here. :)

[Realist]

It has generally been mod policy (for a few years) not to enforce player-mandated contracts. This is a good policy.

[uniquinous]

it was also policy for a while not to care about cursing.
it was also policy at one point to simply ask for a password change without a sub number

my point is simply that policies sometimes need to be... re-examined. Asking yourself what the general purpose of a moderator is will reveal whether or not one ought to interfere in any particular case. But this is why diversity in mindset is a good thing. :)

[Drunk With Hate]

So this may be kinda.. lame of me to ask, but none the less..

It would appear we have differing opinions on this topic. Is there a chance the mods can talk about it and come to common ground? Realist says no, uniq says maybe.

[Jeffery]

The problem is that without hard evidence that someone is purposefully tricking people, it should NOT be a punishable offense.
In this case there was no intent to defraud anybody. And yet someone was banned from a server and had their stats dropped.

Any policy thast has mods kicking people from a server without knwoign the full story and having evidence at hand will be an unfair policy.

[Wizzy`]

Maybe he can let you play on a dummy account?


-Duo

Ahhh...I miss the days of me playing on dummy accounts..I found out the passwords.
I freakin' pwn.

[Realist]

my point is simply that policies sometimes need to be... re-examined.

Only bad policies need to be reexamined. Hence the second sentence in my last post. See, I cover everything.

[Wizzy`]

it was also policy for a while not to care about cursing.
it was also policy at one point to simply ask for a password change without a sub number

my point is simply that policies sometimes need to be... re-examined. Asking yourself what the general purpose of a moderator is will reveal whether or not one ought to interfere in any particular case. But this is why diversity in mindset is a good thing. :)

You dare question the self-proclaimed God?

[uniquinous]

Only bad policies need to be reexamined. Hence the second sentence in my last post. See, I cover everything.

Ya know there's a law in New Mexico which prohibits the hunting of whale from a moving vehicle. This was seen as a good law for many many moons. yes this is entirely fabricated, but similar laws were actually made in various parts

Times change, as do opinions. And yes, you do cover everything :)

[Drunk With Hate]

So you game mods have a forum right? Maybe talk about it / start a poll there?

[Jeffery]

Ya know there's a law in New Mexico which prohibits the hunting of whale from a moving vehicle. This was seen as a good law for many many moons. yes this is entirely fabricated, but similar laws were actually made in various parts

Times change, as do opinions. And yes, you do cover everything :)
You know there is also a difference between reviewing a policy, and only certain mods deciding to ban people randomly just because they can, right?

[uniquinous]

yes, which is why I think you've gotten multiple community members AND mods in this thread reviewing that very policy. Let's also make no mistake, while bludz has even said he was sorry, this wasn't a random banning, as you claim, Jeffery. Let's also remember that the reason this is a debate that has two well-founded sides is because things are not that clear on this issue.

I for one would really like to hear more community feedback. Should people who deliberately trick their opponent into battles that give them some advantage be kicked if such a situation is proven?

[Soda]

Blud doesn't need an explanation, because blud > you.

[Jeffery]

Laggity

[Jeffery]

yes, which is why I think you've gotten multiple community members AND mods in this thread reviewing that very policy. Let's also make no mistake, while bludz has even said he was sorry, this wasn't a random banning, as you claim, Jeffery. Let's also remember that the reason this is a debate that has two well-founded sides is because things are not that clear on this issue.

I for one would really like to hear more community feedback. Should people who deliberately trick their opponent into battles that give them some advantage be kicked if such a situation is proven?
Except there was no reviewing of it. There was Blud saying he made a mistake, Realist saying what the current policy was supposed to be, and you declaring that you don;t care what any policies were, you'd kick anyone you wanted just because you could.

[Teacher]

(Dust off shoulders...I'm back for the time being)

Lets be honest here, correct me if I'm wrong but don't mods have enough things going on with their other duties than to resolve spats between two players? I will admit that it sucks being tricked, but shit happens, you either win the match and continue on, or you lose the match and continue on to re-gain your stats.

In this case, Blood asked all the questions he could come up with in order to make his judgement. However, because he failed to ask the proper questions, and apparently Mantis did not see the need to give him all the information this would prove to be a perfect example of why Mods should not kick for this reason. People will continue to find different ways to cheat, for some it seems to be second nature. These same people will begin to gain a bad reputation, in which case people will know not to play them.

My opinion: No, mods should not be enforcing user-initiated contracts, as it would take up too much of a mod's time in order to ensure that he/she has all the facts. Why not treat these types of battles the same way you treat clans? Last I knew, mods attempt to stay out of Mod politics, such as someone giving away their "leader" position to someone that will not give it back.

Lastly, HELLO EVERYONE!!! LONG TIME NO SEE.

[Terps rock]

Unique are you kiddding me? Did you just neg me to tell me that I shouldn't have made this thread?
Wtf is making a thread for?
If a thread is for discussion on a subject then then please explain. Seeing how there are no rules posted ANYWHERE about this situation being a bannable offense you can't be
I was not even sure who was involved.
This thread has proved to be useful, so you can get off your mighty throne and treat people of this game like people.

My god, people on this game make me sick.

[Drunk With Hate]

People can neg for any reason. Uniq is a moron and negs for lame reasons, just as he bans for lame reasons. Anyway, just ignore it. He has been negging me every chance he can since I spoke out against him.

[Terps rock]

It wasn't the neg that bothered me. It was what the neg said.

[uniquinous]

Then you should have PMed me, instead of going on publicly to complain about the big bad mods acting against you. That was actually the message behind the neg: PM to contact mods, don't make threads/posts to talk to one person. Unless, of course, the only actual outcome you wanted was the awe-inspiring gem of knowledge from such people as...

.. ...

dirka.


Heck if you wanted a strong counter-mod argument that at least used some logic, at least PM Jeffery. He's knowledgable, at the very least.


The fact still remains, there are many situations which are not specifically written down in the rulebooks which any noob off the street can tell you are unfair or wrong. For example, no where will you find that sexual harassment of sergiy is a bannable offense, but I can guaruntee you that if you show up at his house and give him a sore ass you're not gonna be welcomed on this game after that.

Re: Teacher outlook - The problem with clans is that the person who "loses" their leadership at some point has to willingly give it away, and they know exactly who they give it to. In this case, mantis did NOT know what match he was getting into.

Now a valid solution is just letting it happen and having people's reputation be affected for it. Everyone knows now that Terps conveniently "forgets" to actually abide by the setup, giving himself an unfair advantage. But I also believe that IF someone can prove trickery of this nature (which is hard to do in cases like this, and downright impossible for clan leadership problems), it's acceptible for a mod to take action to keep the game fair, AFTER several attemps were made for a draw/reconciliation.

you'd kick anyone you wanted just because you could.Poor Jeffery, and I just said you were halfway reasonable. You disappoint me. save the childish "I DONT CARE!" response, I already know

[***Duo***]

Now a valid solution is just letting it happen and having people's reputation be affected for it. Everyone knows now that Terps conveniently "forgets" to actually abide by the setup, giving himself an unfair advantage. But I also believe that IF someone can prove trickery of this nature (which is hard to do in cases like this, and downright impossible for clan leadership problems), it's acceptible for a mod to take action to keep the game fair, AFTER several attemps were made for a draw/reconciliation.


Why?
Why should a moderator do ANYTHING about this type of trickery? It's not cheating. Chat is part of the game, and it's the persons choice to believe or not believe the chat.
I know I've posted one or two threads here about being tricked into a game, and won--so it's not impossible to come back from something like that.
Plus, after the match, if you win or not, you know not to trust the person, and you spread the word.


-Duo

[WindsOfTime]

this kind of behaviour should be punished. or at least, we should have something like that notice system i saw.

[***Duo***]

this kind of behaviour should be punished. or at least, we should have something like that notice system i saw.

Why?


-Duo

[uniquinous]

Why?
Why should a moderator do ANYTHING about this type of trickery? It's not cheating. Chat is part of the game, and it's the persons choice to believe or not believe the chat.
I know I've posted one or two threads here about being tricked into a game, and won--so it's not impossible to come back from something like that.
Plus, after the match, if you win or not, you know not to trust the person, and you spread the word.


-Duo

Yes, anything's possible, and I congratulate you for coming through in such a disadvantage, but what do you feel the purpose of a moderator is?

[WindsOfTime]

do you have an issue with the notice system or the mod intervention?

[Forest_Archer]

I think it's neggable, but not bannable.

"freestyle" and "turtle" are player-made additions and versions to the game. Everyone has a different definition to the turtle.

[WindsOfTime]

not if you use a rule system. and an all out rush cannot be considered a turt period.

[***Duo***]

Yes, anything's possible, and I congratulate you for coming through in such a disadvantage, but what do you feel the purpose of a moderator is?

A moderator upkeeps the game. They ban players who use trickery such as the "F5 trick", because in that case, there is no way to fight back. Yet, at the same time, someone shouldn't have been stupid enough to listen to that person.
Moderators also stop spammers, people using foul language, and boosters, among other such things.

Again, it shouldn't be a moderators duty to listen to someone whine about getting tricked into a match that was unfair. I can see personal feelings being hurt here--dealing with stats and such, but really, the game is just to have fun, and if you can't have fun with it, you should get out of here.
Why don't moderators listen to people that get their clans taken? Or have their accounts "hacked"?

Alongside of that, there are FAR less people that try to trick you into an unfair match, than there are that will play you honestly.

do you have an issue with the notice system or the mod intervention?

Erm... no?


-Duo

[uniquinous]

that is all very valid, but let me just respond directly...

A moderator upkeeps the game. They ban players who use trickery such as the "F5 trick", because in that case, there is no way to fight back. Yet, at the same time, someone shouldn't have been stupid enough to listen to that person.
Moderators also stop spammers, people using foul language, and boosters, among other such things.You're using a lot of specifics - I suppose I was looking for a generalization, which could pretty much be summed up as "A mod is supposed to keep things fair and remove players that try to intentionally harm the community." Do you agree that mods should keep things fair? If not, why? If so, do you feel the match between terps and mantis after such an agreement was fair? If not fair, you see my point. If fair, I see yours.

Again, it shouldn't be a moderators duty to listen to someone whine about...LOL - That's actually the entirety of a mod's job :p

Why don't moderators listen to people that get their clans taken? Or have their accounts "hacked"?There's no proof for those things. Ever.

[Terps rock]

Then you should have PMed me, instead of going on publicly to complain about the big bad mods acting against you. That was actually the message behind the neg: PM to contact mods, don't make threads/posts to talk to one person. Unless, of course, the only actual outcome you wanted was the awe-inspiring gem of knowledge from such people as...

.. ...

dirka.


Heck if you wanted a strong counter-mod argument that at least used some logic, at least PM Jeffery. He's knowledgable, at the very least.


The fact still remains, there are many situations which are not specifically written down in the rulebooks which any noob off the street can tell you are unfair or wrong. For example, no where will you find that sexual harassment of sergiy is a bannable offense, but I can guaruntee you that if you show up at his house and give him a sore ass you're not gonna be welcomed on this game after that.

Re: Teacher outlook - The problem with clans is that the person who "loses" their leadership at some point has to willingly give it away, and they know exactly who they give it to. In this case, mantis did NOT know what match he was getting into.

Now a valid solution is just letting it happen and having people's reputation be affected for it. Everyone knows now that Terps conveniently "forgets" to actually abide by the setup, giving himself an unfair advantage. But I also believe that IF someone can prove trickery of this nature (which is hard to do in cases like this, and downright impossible for clan leadership problems), it's acceptible for a mod to take action to keep the game fair, AFTER several attemps were made for a draw/reconciliation.

Poor Jeffery, and I just said you were halfway reasonable. You disappoint me. save the childish "I DONT CARE!" response, I already know

Why would I contact you!
Would you even have known what I was talking about... I wanted to discuss with whomever booted me and mantis... And thats why I created the thread. Uniq, you're an idiot.

[***Duo***]

that is all very valid, but let me just respond directly...

You're using a lot of specifics - I suppose I was looking for a generalization, which could pretty much be summed up as "A mod is supposed to keep things fair and remove players that try to intentionally harm the community." Do you agree that mods should keep things fair? If not, why? If so, do you feel the match between terps and mantis after such an agreement was fair? If not fair, you see my point. If fair, I see yours.

LOL - That's actually the entirety of a mod's job :p

There's no proof for those things. Ever.


1st paragraph -

I agree that a moderator is supposed to keep order, and supposed to keep the game healthy.
However, I don't see why they should be able to take action against this type of thing. There isn't a reason to. As Forest mentioned, "Turtle" and "Freestyle" are player made foundations, representing a type of formation that we have in our OWN mind. The other player could have the exact opposite in their head. I've "Turtled" a person that had a Dragon Speaker Mage, Dragon, 2 Pyros, a Cleric, etc. His excuse was that a Turtle for him meant that he had a Cleric in the back. Don't get me wrong, I was mad and felt tricked, but I realised it was my own stupidity that got me into that.
I believe that if all the evidence was presented, from what I saw, it was completely fair. Mantis got screwed by accident, but even if that weren't the case, I'd say he got screwed for being too trusting. If he cares so much about stats, he should care a lot to know the other player won't cheat him. Another thing I've always thought of: "You should always be able to defend the stats you've got, otherwise, why do you have them?" It's kind of a philosophy that a player is as good as their stats, and they should be willing to risk them at all costs to prove that those stats are rightfully belonging to them.

2nd paragraph -

You only took half of that quote. :)

3rd paragraph -

That, and the case that the person was too much of an idiot to not know what or who to trust.
"Yeah, just give me your password and I'll get you stats!"
"Ok! It's 123456789."
"Cool!"
*Leave game*
"Hey clan mates, this kids password is..."


-Duo

[uniquinous]

Right, but this wasn't a case of user-defined terms such as "turtle" or "freestyle". The agreement was "no dsm". That's pretty straightforward and standard. There's no possible way to misinterpret that.

While I agree anyone should be able to prove they are worth their weight in stats, I believe it should be done fairly. If I played a 1500 grey with a ranked mod account that had a 71 damage dsm, it doesn't mean the grey isn't worth 1500 stats, it means I had an unfair advantage. This is a similar case. People should be able to defend their stats in a fair fight.

paragraph 2: indeed :)

paragraph 3: that's true stupidity, and the big difference between the two cases. someone willingly agreeing to give away their password is much different then being tricked into a game where one player has a huge advantage over another.

[Punishment]

uniquinous,

the game should be freestyle all the time. Someone who restricts a unit to gain an unfair advantage themself shouldn't be fair.

If your set can't stand up to a certain unit, you shouldn't use the set, not restrict the unit. That's like me making all the games I play be no LW no wisp and same sides.

It's fair, because both of us should follow the rules.. but I have 7 pyros front row o_O

Mantit, you're becoming like dape :p Restricting units to give yourself every advantage possible in the game.

[uniquinous]

I disagree - before we got GA/wisp changes, people requested games with no GA all the time simply because it was an unfair use. Seed himself even acknowledged that fact by changing its abilities.

You have to understand, I'm a grey player - every game is free, always. As soon as you throw in units that can teleport 6 squares away, and do 27 damage in a single hit, you can't keep the game the same.

Regardless of what anyone believes all games ought to be, THIS game had a (reasonable) agreement to it, which was immediately broken.

[Cuathon]

puni, dapes condition is entirely different. and you know it.

[Terps rock]

But Unitard, I didn't have a chance to change my set. If he paused for a moment we wouldn't have had this discussion. I was set before his rules were announced.

[Punishment]

puni, dapes condition is entirely different. and you know it.

How so?

Dape restricts rules because that's all he knows.

Mantits and a bunch of other idiots restrict sets because they either
a. Dont' know how to play against a certain unit (And apparently never wish to learn...)
b. Set sucks against it, and instead of changing their set they change the game.



As for you, uniq.

I didn't play much before the GA change, but it was changed by seed. Now that it has been changed, it's no where near the powerhouse it once was. It is quite possibly the easiest unit to block in the game... just move up your knight one and it can't hit the cleric (if you use a standard anti)

Opposite sides it's completely useless.

With the DSM, just put in an Lward, or don't cluster your damn units together. If you need to change the rules of the game to benefit yourself, you stink :)

[Cuathon]

find me a set where you can effectively counter any set i can think of. woops you cant.

and dape is entirely diff. he restricts to a very very very very small style and refuses to play anything but that. period. mantis would probably have agreed to another style if he couldnt play the way he wished.

i ask for turt games quite a bit but i still play free if they wont turt. i just prefer a different style. because the issue is always with styl.e you seem to dumb to understand this. the kind of game is important not because of the units but because of how it is played.

[Teacher]

Alright, first of all; Uni, I can respect the difference between this particular ordeal and my example of clan problems. However, there are similarities between the two. Clan leader brings someone into the clan, after some fast talking clan leader makes the mistake of trusting him with leadership for whatever reason. Player then refuses to uphold his/her end of the deal and refuse to give it back. Leader can either deal with not having a clan or complain about it.

Other example: User A asks for a game with rules set. User B agrees to set rules or verbal agreement and then tricks User A into a game that he/she is not prepared for. User B can either deal with the game, or leave it.

Either way it is the same concept. Both instances are verbal agreements that turned out to be lies on someone's part. So I stand by my opinion. No, mods should not have anything to do with situations like this if they are not willing to interfere with all verbal agreements.

Now, my second comment. Uni, obviously you can neg whomever you want for whatever reason you want, but I have to question as to why Terps should have PM'd you? This apparently is between Mantis, Terps, and Blood. Unless there is a hierarchy that I am not aware of between mods I personally see no reason in Terps PM’ing you.

If you want to start a debate about whether or not mods should intervene in situations such as these, which is one thing. However, Blood has already admitted a mistake, Mantis admits to screwing up by jumping Terp too fast, and I personally think Terp should have showed some common courtesy and agreed with the draw, since he understood there was a misunderstanding.

/Rant

[Terps rock]

Alright, first of all; Uni, I can respect the difference between this particular ordeal and my example of clan problems. However, there are similarities between the two. Clan leader brings someone into the clan, after some fast talking clan leader makes the mistake of trusting him with leadership for whatever reason. Player then refuses to uphold his/her end of the deal and refuse to give it back. Leader can either deal with not having a clan or complain about it.

Other example: User A asks for a game with rules set. User B agrees to set rules or verbal agreement and then tricks User A into a game that he/she is not prepared for. User B can either deal with the game, or leave it.

Either way it is the same concept. Both instances are verbal agreements that turned out to be lies on someone's part. So I stand by my opinion. No, mods should not have anything to do with situations like this if they are not willing to interfere with all verbal agreements.

Now, my second comment. Uni, obviously you can neg whomever you want for whatever reason you want, but I have to question as to why Terps should have PM'd you? This apparently is between Mantis, Terps, and Blood. Unless there is a hierarchy that I am not aware of between mods I personally see no reason in Terps PM’ing you.

If you want to start a debate about whether or not mods should intervene in situations such as these, which is one thing. However, Blood has already admitted a mistake, Mantis admits to screwing up by jumping Terp too fast, and I personally think Terp should have showed some common courtesy and agreed with the draw, since he understood there was a misunderstanding.

/Rant

Yeah, but he definately had a chance to still win... but he refused to play... So lost respect for him didn't feel he deserved a draw.

[Punishment]

find me a set where you can effectively counter any set i can think of. woops you cant.

and dape is entirely diff. he restricts to a very very very very small style and refuses to play anything but that. period. mantis would probably have agreed to another style if he couldnt play the way he wished.

i ask for turt games quite a bit but i still play free if they wont turt. i just prefer a different style. because the issue is always with styl.e you seem to dumb to understand this. the kind of game is important not because of the units but because of how it is played.

Let's see,

Paragraph 1 : The game was designed freestyle. I'm confident that my rush could take on just about any set you can think of, but there are other options. You'd not have a big advantage in any game, but there are sets that really have no weaknesses either.

Best way to counter a GA is basically just a cleric off the back corner. Everyone uses the same position for the cleric, so the GA is useful. Move it one over and you can block the GA completely in 99% of games.

Paragraph 2 : No. While I think Dape is slightly more restrictive, there are people (not noobs, good people (1500+)) who restrict DSM, GA, Stone, etc. I'm not arguing that Mantis is exactly like Dape, but he is doing the Dape thing and restricting units to be used for his own advantage.

Paragraph 3 : I too play turtle and freestyle. I play whatever my opponent wants to play (Mostly because I still play this game to play, not to chat) If someone prefers to use a certain style, let them, but don't restrict me from using my preferred style if you want a game. I'm not understanding what you're trying to say at the end of your paragraph. Maybe if you worded it a little more cleanly I could understand, but from what I read, you are saying that some people don't like to get rushed or something? This is sort of a dumb statement. Sure I prefer not to get bombed, but someone else may prefer to bomb, so I'm not in a position to take away their fun...

[Cuathon]

no teach, they are not the same. lead is giving a way your password to another person. your password. with screenies it is perfectly fine to punish people who lie. so, if you have a screenie of a liar and then of their form you know what happened. whereas with a pass, no one says dont steal my clan. thus the reciever makes no contractual agreement to not steal the clan. now if in the exchange an agreement that leadership will not be moved then mods should in fact step in. however, i can count on one hand the number of times the leader didnt just hand out the pass and not even bother to tell them not to steal lead.

[Cuathon]

okay, ill be more clear. dape is different. if mantis consistently refused any style but what he wanted and added more than one or 2 layers of restrictions, then he would be, dape. just asking for a limited game is not being like dape.

im saying that with most of the better players the issue is not that they cant handle the set but that certain units cause the game to go certain ways and they restrict games to get a style of play that they think is more fun or interesting and not for an advantage. any half decent idiot should be able to make his own set thats takes advantage of the restrictions anyway. its not like only one guy can tailor a set.

yes puni, you do neg for like 10 more.

[Punishment]

okay, ill be more clear. dape is different. if mantis consistently refused any style but what he wanted and added more than one or 2 layers of restrictions, then he would be, dape. just asking for a limited game is not being like dape.

im saying that with most of the better players the issue is not that they cant handle the set but that certain units cause the game to go certain ways and they restrict games to get a style of play that they think is more fun or interesting and not for an advantage. any half decent idiot should be able to make his own set thats takes advantage of the restrictions anyway. its not like only one guy can tailor a set.

yes puni, you do neg for like 10 more.

I disagree with you there.

I think that there are players who have just never learned to play against a certain unit, and don't want to now because they are too scared to lose their stats, or because their set , while good against everything else, stinks against a certain unit.

If someone asks me for a no ga no dsm game, I usually ask them why. Response is 9/10 "It's a cheap unit". "Takes no skill to use" , etc. I often tell them that just because they are unsure of how to use a unit skillfully, that it is still a skillful piece. They usually whine and piss and moan.

So No, I don't think they restrict them because they don't like the way the games turn out. I think they restrict them because they are weak against them, and want to do anything they can to win a game.

[Cuathon]

fine, its not my fault you play idiots. :)
that is a ridiculous reason to restrict a unit. except the oldschool GA was cheap. its just that both of you could be cheap.

[Office_Shredder]

How did mantis contact blud? By an IM program? The concept behind this unfairly benefits people who either personally know mods, or who are willing to break the TOS and get on a second account at the same time to talk to a mod (and that isn't as likely to happen either). Either way, the inherent inbalance in the system means the official policy should be to leave it alone

[uniquinous]

But Unitard, I didn't have a chance to change my set. If he paused for a moment we wouldn't have had this discussion. I was set before his rules were announced.Yes, this is why bloodz appologized. Nonetheless, the GENERAL case of one player jumping another under false pretenses is still being debated. btw, I like how you complain so much about my mean neggy and then revenge neg with "mofo". Stay classy noobcakes :wink2:

Mantits and a bunch of other idiots restrict sets because they either
a. Dont' know how to play against a certain unit (And apparently never wish to learn...)
b. Set sucks against it, and instead of changing their set they change the game.No, this is YOUR interpretation of why they do this. In a later post, you say "Sure I prefer not to get bombed, but someone else may prefer to bomb, so I'm not in a position to take away their fun...". Well, saying you MUST play with a dsm is taking away mantis's fun. I don't understand how you can see including unfair styles is ok, but restricting unfair styles is not.



Alright, first of all; Uni, I can respect the difference between this particular ordeal and my example of clan problems. However, there are similarities between the two. Clan leader brings someone into the clan, after some fast talking clan leader makes the mistake of trusting him with leadership for whatever reason. Player then refuses to uphold his/her end of the deal and refuse to give it back. Leader can either deal with not having a clan or complain about it. The KEY difference though, is that you can not under any circumstances prove the leadership issue. You absolutely can prove this type of issue with screenshots. So yes, I agree in your all or none dealing with verbal agreements, but these aren't the same to lump together under that logic due to the ability to prove them.

Now, my second comment. Uni, obviously you can neg whomever you want for whatever reason you want, but I have to question as to why Terps should have PM'd you? This apparently is between Mantis, Terps, and Blood. Unless there is a hierarchy that I am not aware of between mods I personally see no reason in Terps PM’ing you. Sorry, I believe you misinterpretted. I said he should have PMed the player and mods involved. If he didn't know which mod it was, he could just PM around to find out who. But no, I never wanted him to PM me directly.

Paragraph 1 : The game was designed freestyle. Things change. This game was designed without such units as the dragon tyrant, dsm, GA, wisp. These things completely changed "freestyle" as we knew it.

Sure I prefer not to get bombed, but someone else may prefer to bomb, so I'm not in a position to take away their fun...So you get to detemine that's fun enough to allow, but not no-dsm matches, eh?

[Punishment]

fine, its not my fault you play idiots. :)
that is a ridiculous reason to restrict a unit. except the oldschool GA was cheap. its just that both of you could be cheap.

I play Everyone, lol.

Maybe the oldschool GA was cheap. It was changed, and now isn't cheap.

I actually spoke with mantis, and i asked him why he restricts the DSM in free games. He said it was because his set was weak against them. I told him he was a noob and should change his set :p

No units are cheap now. The game is in a good balance. (Don't argue. The game is fine. It is you that sucks.)

By restricting of units you disrupt the equilibrium and DESTROY EVERYTHING!!!!

[uniquinous]

How did mantis contact blud? By an IM program? The concept behind this unfairly benefits people who either personally know mods, or who are willing to break the TOS and get on a second account at the same time to talk to a mod (and that isn't as likely to happen either). Either way, the inherent inbalance in the system means the official policy should be to leave it aloneI've had many people PM me while it's going on...

By restricting of units you disrupt the equilibrium and DESTROY EVERYTHING!!!!
Sometimes your playfulness is really cute.

Sometimes.

[Punishment]

No, this is YOUR interpretation of why they do this. In a later post, you say "Sure I prefer not to get bombed, but someone else may prefer to bomb, so I'm not in a position to take away their fun...". Well, saying you MUST play with a dsm is taking away mantis's fun. I don't understand how you can see including unfair styles is ok, but restricting unfair styles is not.


I'm not saying you must play with the DSM. I'm saying that you should allow all units.


Things change. This game was designed without such units as the dragon tyrant, dsm, GA, wisp. These things completely changed "freestyle" as we knew it.

So you get to detemine that's fun enough to allow, but not no-dsm matches, eh?

Sure things change. The game is in a nice spot right now. No type of set is too powerful, and the people who say differently are dumb. Freestyle is all the units allowed. If Seed wanted people to play without the Ga, we'd have no GA.

I like think that Seed thought a lot about each ujnit before putting it in. He wouldn't put something in that made the game worse. Each update has made the game better. Seed, being the strategical Genius thyat he is, wouldn't put a bad unit in.

I have no idea what you're trying to say. I don't use the DSM, but I don't restrict it either.

[Terps rock]

The KEY difference though, is that you can not under any circumstances prove the leadership issue. You absolutely can prove this type of issue with screenshots. So yes, I agree in your all or none dealing with verbal agreements, but these aren't the same to lump together under that logic due to the ability to prove them.


both can be proved by s/s

Oh and I negged you because I disagreed with what you said in the neg. You said I shouldn't have created the thread.

[Teacher]

The KEY difference though, is that you can not under any circumstances prove the leadership issue. You absolutely can prove this type of issue with screenshots. So yes, I agree in your all or none dealing with verbal agreements, but these aren't the same to lump together under that logic due to the ability to prove them.

In this situation, we have a perfect example of a mod taking into consideration one side of an argument and it turned out to be a mistake. What makes you think this will not continue to happen? For the second matter, lets say that I took a screen shot of me making an agreement to share leadership and the other person failed to give it back, are you saying that you would and could return it? Or would my answer still be, "sorry mods do not get into clan politics"? If the policy is that both parties will be contacted prior to a banning or booting, then ok, I would have a different opinion about it.

Why not make it capable for the creator of the clan to take leadership back with a command? .... Sorry didn't feel like finding a thread to place that suggestion in.

Sorry, I believe you misinterpretted. I said he should have PMed the player and mods involved. If he didn't know which mod it was, he could just PM around to find out who. But no, I never wanted him to PM me directly. I possibly did, in which case I retract my statement.

If a person feels comfortable playing only a specific type of setup, then they should have the right to ask for that setup. If they are unable to find opponents willing to play according the his/her restrictions, then it is their own damn fault. I play them all personally, and I suck at all of them. :p

Instead of stating people should not make restrictions, let us answer the current debate...Should Mods interfere with game discrepancies? I am actually curious to see everyone's answers and/or opinions.

[Lonely Tylenol]

Look, since this conversation has basically dissolved into bickering, which I am oddly attracted to (in a magnetic sense), I'll add my $.02.

I'll make this short and blunt.

Kicking because of disagreements in gameplay is tantamount to kicking grey jumpers. Sure, grey jumping (and bombing a non DSM game, or rushing a turtle) IS frowned upon by the general community, will kill your respect among other players & will get you expelled from most if not all self-respecting clans... But ultimately, from a moderator's standpoint, it is the paid right of any gold player to use their units as they please. Even if grey jumping is not accepted by the gaming community, golds have every right to do it, since they paid for that right.

The ONLY excuse anybody might have to kick someone in-game is if they are time-stalling (which would require two or more screenshots at different times to verify that no move is being made by the opponent) and cybering (one screenshot will do, if the shoot-ee shows willing participation both can be kicked). Otherwise, mods are interfering with private in-game matters with which stats for both players are being put on the line. If somebody uses units agreed against pre-game, it's the responsibility of the participants of that game to squabble amongst themselves.

Furthermore, I'm going to say that Terps' making of this thread was completely justifiable. It would have been one thing if he knew what happened, who kicked him and wanted to ask THAT person why, but since Terps didn't know who kicked him, it's perfectly reasonable to ask in a public forum, where he can get answers from various people who can possibly point out who and what.

Sure, there is the unfortunate side-effect of receiving feedback from

such people as...

.. ...

dirka.

...And yet life goes on.

The only person this thread really hurts is Bludhoundz. Not to say that Bludhoundz should really be to blame for this, of course. Hell, I've made tons of mistakes, definitely more than Bludz has. For instance, when somebody asks to cyber and somebody jokingly responds with a fake number, I can get confused and kick the joker. It's happened more than once. The only way this hurts Bludz is it opens this scenario to public criticism.

[uniquinous]

I'd say time stalling is harder to prove and less of an unfair offense then agreeing to a particular match and then coming in with an unfair advantage.

To put things in my own perspective, I've only gone to kick someone for bombing a no-bomb game when they tricked a legends mod. He wound up beating the guy anyway, so it wasn't needed. I have kicked (once) for stalling, after apropriate s/s (the ones where the person says "I CAN STALL ALL I WANT AND YOU CANT DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT!!!" really help).

But yes, teacher this is a poor example to use simply because of the circumstances, but not all are like this. And yes, if someone came up to me and politely asked me to watch the safe transfer of a clan, and I agreed, if anything went wrong in the handoff I'd take action, having first-hand evidence of the agreement, IF I agreed to watch. Same for matches. However, no proof, no action; and I have yet to see a single instance where a leadership theft had any evidence whatsoever.

So I agree it should be all or none. The determining factor is proof.

[Cuathon]

I play Everyone, lol.

Maybe the oldschool GA was cheap. It was changed, and now isn't cheap.

I actually spoke with mantis, and i asked him why he restricts the DSM in free games. He said it was because his set was weak against them. I told him he was a noob and should change his set :p

No units are cheap now. The game is in a good balance. (Don't argue. The game is fine. It is you that sucks.)

By restricting of units you disrupt the equilibrium and DESTROY EVERYTHING!!!!

i grant you that mantis's reason for restricting makes him a dumbass. but there are legitimate reasons.

the game is at equilibrium(supposedly) at any given time.
i do not suck, i can and will play any style. but there are some i would rather play because they are more interesting. since there was equilibrium BEFORE a given unit was put in play, then there is equilibrium WITHOUT that unit.
so your point is bullshit.

[meat.eater]

Use any unit you want in any situation you want. It will not be considered "cheap" from the games perspective. What your status is among your peers is your own thing and you're in charge of that and how you want to form your game to match it. As long as you dont have 3 dragons, you're welcome to use any unit at your disposal at any time.

[Duffman]

I have three Dragons.

Wheeee~

[meat.eater]

Slaughter yourself, big guy.

[Terps rock]

I have three Dragons.

Wheeee~

And the slowest graffiti artist in the world.

[Cuathon]

i'd have 2 DSMs and 2 dragons if i was allowed to use them :)

of course no unit is cheap. thats silly.

[Duffman]

And the slowest graffiti artist in the world.
He's been doing the same art with no rest for over 2 years now. So EXCUSE~~ HIM for not being up to your regular graffiti speed standards.

[Teacher]

Uni, once again our debate ends with a difference of opinion (damn midterms are taking all the fight out of me :p ) and yet agreement to an extent.

However, I am inclined to agree with LT's argument. Either way, I do not think that mods should get involved, they should take the same stance as they do with clan politics.

...Back to midterms...

[Terps rock]

He's been doing the same art with no rest for over 2 years now. So EXCUSE~~ HIM for not being up to your regular graffiti speed standards.

No... It's his job. I want top performance at all times.

[Duffman]

No... It's his job. I want top performance at all times.
Least he has a job. Ya bum.

[uniquinous]

Uni, once again our debate ends with a difference of opinion (damn midterms are taking all the fight out of me :p ) and yet agreement to an extent.

However, I am inclined to agree with LT's argument. Either way, I do not think that mods should get involved, they should take the same stance as they do with clan politics.

...Back to midterms...

difference of opinion is fine in my book so long as it's respectful, friend :)

[Jeffery]

difference of opinion is fine in my book so long as it's respectful, friend :)
Except that in this case your "opinion" will continue to encourage you and other mods to kick people when they don;t have a legitimate reason.

When in-game mods were first brought uo as a valid option, policing of those mods was one of the most important subjects discussed. The role of the mods is to enforce a fair and constant ruling for the community to come to expect.

And here we have a case where vertain mods have decided WITHOUT DISCUSSION to change the roles of the mods, and take a more proactive stance among player disputes. Uniq, you are 100% full of shit to sit and say this is a discussion for you to think about what should happen. You've already stated you'd kick for these issues. You, and apparently Blud, have decided that 3 years worth of a policy to stay out of players "mandated" rules and stick to TAP Administrated rules is no longer good enough.

[uniquinous]

my "opinion" only works when there is absolute proof

[Alaric]

i say we have mods with respected opinion, so they can just blam someone when ever there opinion hought it was the right thing to do.

[meat.eater]

Even if there is proof of "agreeing to a different style then you play," this is a rule used to DQ someone from a tourney, not kick them from a game. It's not our job to tell people how to play.

[Duffman]

Can we stick to being off-topic.... please?

[Terps rock]

Can we stick to being off-topic.... please?

Have to find a golden mean.

[Drunk With Hate]

Has anybody brought up the fact that it is hard to define setups anyway? Unless we have an official guide, we really can't say someone did something wrong. It has been suggested that the game itself show what kind of setup a person is using when they place their unit on a tile. This was shot down for that very reason.

[***Duo***]

Right, but this wasn't a case of user-defined terms such as "turtle" or "freestyle". The agreement was "no dsm". That's pretty straightforward and standard. There's no possible way to misinterpret that.


That.

And, in response:

Didn't I say that even if that wasn't the case, he got screwed by being too trusting, and yet, also by luck.
(Because apparently, Mantis jumped to his tile before he had time to change his setup.)


-Duo

[Terps rock]

drunk... forms had nothing to do with my situation... it was no dsm...
But yeah duo like as soon as I hit the enter button for sure... he got me...

[Drunk With Hate]

drunk... forms had nothing to do with my situation... it was no dsm...
But yeah duo like as soon as I hit the enter button for sure... he got me...

There is really no difference. Granted you can prove if a dsm is there or not, whereas a rush is a matter of opinion. They should still be treated the same because it is a matter of units on the board. I still want to see a mod conscencious(sp?).

[meat.eater]

consensus.

You made that word incredibly more complicated than it actually is.

[uniquinous]

I still want to see a mod conscencious(sp?).hold your breath

[Drunk With Hate]

consensus.

You made that word incredibly more complicated than it actually is.

lol

[meat.eater]

lol

Which, actually, rather nicely describes the way you think.

[Drunk With Hate]

Which, actually, rather nicely describes the way you think.

At times, yea.

[Jeffery]

Right, but this wasn't a case of user-defined terms such as "turtle" or "freestyle". The agreement was "no dsm". That's pretty straightforward and standard. There's no possible way to misinterpret that.


Just noticed this garbage, so sorry for being a bit between when it was spewed and my response.

Gongrats Uniq for not knowing anything about what happened. Both parties involved in the game, and the mod who wrongly (and admittedly so) kicked one party for this have admitted to how things went, which you obviously chose to ignore so as to seem correct.

The situation, as agreed by both sides, was that terps was on a square when Mantis ased for the no dsm game. When terps said sure, Mantis jumped him immediately., There was no time for Terps to have even checked his setup, let alone change it to a no dsm set.
So all your crap abotu Terps baiting peopel into games with lying about setups is just that, crap.

Of course, I am sure you actually know what happened. But, in order for you to make "your opinion" more correct have repeatedly ignored it.

So please Uniq, continue preaching how you are always right, and how you will continue to kick people just because you can. Ignore the other mods, and ignore the way things not only have been, but are.
Responsible mods will continue following the accepted norms of TAO. Then there is you, who just decide to do things your own way, and who cares who gets kicked as long as you get your little surge of power.

[S_K_O_F]

I can tell you right now that I will jump any Gold I see fit regardless of their setup. Even if it means I could lose.

This whole demanding a certain type of game crap is ridiculous.

[theburning]

General discussion says "Discuss general topics outside Tactics Arena Online world here"

Notice the "outside Tactics Arena Online world here" part?

[Cuathon]

did you notice that you are a forum nazi? and that it doesnt really matter?

[Terps rock]

General discussion says "Discuss general topics outside Tactics Arena Online world here"

Notice the "outside Tactics Arena Online world here" part?

Where should it be posted... And I just figured general discussion could be game related never fead the sub-heading...

Would this be Revelation sever?... I know lots of people read that.

[Cuathon]

ignore jules. silly forum nazi.

[Jeffery]

General discussion says "Discuss general topics outside Tactics Arena Online world here"

Notice the "outside Tactics Arena Online world here" part?
Then change the description, because that is not what the section has been used for for three years, and you damn well know it.

[Cuathon]

but she is a hypocritical forum nazi :)

[uniquinous]

Just noticed this garbage, so sorry for being a bit between when it was spewed and my response.It's not the first time you missed something dear. For example...

Gongrats Uniq for not knowing anything about what happened. Both parties involved in the game, and the mod who wrongly (and admittedly so) kicked one party for this have admitted to how things went, which you obviously chose to ignore so as to seem correct.

The situation, as agreed by both sides, was that terps was on a square when Mantis ased for the no dsm game. When terps said sure, Mantis jumped him immediately., There was no time for Terps to have even checked his setup, let alone change it to a no dsm set.
So all your crap abotu Terps baiting peopel into games with lying about setups is just that, crap.

Of course, I am sure you actually know what happened. But, in order for you to make "your opinion" more correct have repeatedly ignored it.

Perhaps you should go read this post (http://www.tacticsarena.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1019831&postcount=78). Notice the clarification, and the words in CAPS. Generally this means you should read those words. I've not been arguing about Terps at all. Seems that first thing wasn't the only one you missed. I know, reading is hard some times dear, and as amusing as your four paragraph rant dedicated to me is, the fact is you just went off on a rant about something I wasn't even arguing about. Bloodz admitted he was wrong. He's acknowledged that. I've acknowledged that. And yet, there's still a discussion to be had regarding a mods role in fairness in these situations. It's a pretty good debate! :)

So please Uniq, continue preaching how you are always right, and how you will continue to kick people just because you can. Ignore the other mods, and ignore the way things not only have been, but are.
Responsible mods will continue following the accepted norms of TAO. Then there is you, who just decide to do things your own way, and who cares who gets kicked as long as you get your little surge of power.

Do I see some jealousy there Jeffery? You're not upset you're not a mod, are you? :huh: Now if you wanna cry about things that aren't actually happening, you can go sit in the dunce corner with dirka. Otherwise, try ensuring you know what I'm actually arguing before ranting for no reason. Yes, I know, you don't care.

Nonetheless, that was incredibly amusing Jeffery - you should do that more often :)


So again, since Terps and now Jeffery seemed to have missed the same thing I will restate: I am talking about the general case where one person states a rule for a game which can not be misinterpretted, and the other person purposely disregards that setup in order to gain an unfair advantage within the match.



EDIT: just to clarify, in case someone decides to go nit-picky: I'm not saying i was always debating the general case. When i thought terps case applied, i used it as an example (such as in this (http://www.tacticsarena.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1019782&postcount=65) post - but clearly (as i specified) my argument moved to the general once things were better known

[Terps rock]

Uniq, no one really wants you. I doubt Jeffery is jealous of your modship. Jeffery is a legend here, more than anything you ever can and will be. He is more helpful in every way. He actually helps people, and has a logical sense of rationality.

I think he just pities you.

[uniquinous]

it was a joke kid. I think most people know jeffery's stance on modship - he'd ban everyone immediately (which is why I found that rant so amusing).

and please, don't try to attack me with "he's more popular than you" - you will need something sharper then that to pierce my skin, and methinks you're too dull to accomplish that

[Blood And Gore]

it was a joke kid. I think most people know jeffery's stance on modship - he'd ban everyone immediately (which is why I found that rant so amusing).

and please, don't try to attack me with "he's more popular than you" - you will need something sharper then that to pierce my skin, and methinks you're too dull to accomplish that

Uni iz teh pwnage :cool2:

[mantis33]

Uniq, no one really wants you. I doubt Jeffery is jealous of your modship. Jeffery is a legend here, more than anything you ever can and will be. He is more helpful in every way. He actually helps people, and has a logical sense of rationality.

I think he just pities you.

Did anyone else fall off their chair laughing when he said that Jeffery tries to help people? LMAO. :bigsmile:

[Blood And Gore]

Did anyone else fall off their chair laughing when he said that Jeffery tries to help people? LMAO. :bigsmile:

That'd me me right here. Jeffreys cool and all, but if he had to power of a mod, all noobs would be banned. Which is good, but than he'd ban everyone who makes fun of his clowns, than the people who go against him, and he'd go until he pretty much banned everybody.:p He's cool though.

[Terps rock]

That'd me me right here. Jeffreys cool and all, but if he had to power of a mod, all noobs would be banned. Which is good, but than he'd ban everyone who makes fun of his clowns, than the people who go against him, and he'd go until he pretty much banned everybody.:p He's cool though.

He doesn't mind the people who are new to the game. I have seen how much he has helped those in the gold account section. Jeff is a really good guy. And the man is personally some one I truly admire. Yeah, he has the funny outside with the clowns, and the flamage; but he knows what must be done and how to do it.

[Terps rock]

I don't feel this thread belongs here. I am not trying to tell the community about a battle. I wanted feedback on a situation... I still say REV!

[Cuathon]

yell at burning cause she is a forum nazi.

and shut the the hell up. uni is helpful and we all love him/her. except dirka but thats a special issue :)'

what the hell is an alein?

[Terps rock]

yell at burning cause she is a forum nazi.

and shut the the hell up. uni is helpful and we all love him/her. except dirka but thats a special issue :)'

what the hell is an alein?
I don't.
And A joke me and Kyir took to far...

[uniquinous]

I honestly think the issue here is Terps's active time here. SRSLY take a look at it. He was here in the day when Jeffery had a (relatively) greater amount of helpful and informative posts pointing people in the right direction. He's also been gone for nearly the entirety of my modhood. Is it any wonder that his only views here are "uni does nothing and jeffery helps everyone"?

He's just... behind the times a bit :)

and Cuathon, go easy on theburning. Even the very first response of this thread noted how it wasn't quite where it was supposed to be. Even terps wants it in rev (And not GD). I'm not gonna argue with you too much, cuz let's face it, you're too hot, but... just go easy. You're ok. I'm ok. Kumbaya? Or if you're a mario fan, Goombaya?

[Cuathon]

aw but its fun to harras julia. she gets all riled up :)

[Terps rock]

out of the times... How dare you, Are you telling me I never had a Coke before!

[uniquinous]

aw but its fun to harras julia. she gets all riled up :)

*sigh* if only the mods could use that excuse against people like you in return :p

[Cuathon]

she can? but i wont get riled up?

[uniquinous]

well, you wouldn't be here for us to see WHAT you would be or not be ;)

[Cuathon]

only if i got an IP ban would i disappear.

[~SlayeR~]

Lol, kicking someone for not having the right units? Not right!

[Ludican]

Sure isnt that tight in my Point of view.

[uniquinous]

erm... :huh:

why don't you think it's right slayer? For the people who worry about it not being in the rules and what will or will not affect them, here's a pretty good rule of thumb:
as long as you're not trying to actively screw someone else over, you got nothing to worry about ;)

[Luis XVI]

O well, something similar happened to me, FreashEvaus asked for a game, and I asked if he wanted it a turt game, and he said yes... and look what he did.

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/8938/chingfr6.jpg

He is the purple one :D

It's sad to see what he has to do to get stats.

Too bad I didn't have a mod :(

[Terps rock]

if your form didn't blow you could have won... His set didn't look too strong vs a good turt.

[Match Strike]

Too bad I didn't have a mod :(
What would that have done?

[Luis XVI]

Maybe if it was bludhoundz he would have kikcked him? XD

[Jeffery]

Rico Suave (the owner of that account) has long been known for bait and switching.

[Zander]

O well, something similar happened to me, FreashEvaus asked for a game, and I asked if he wanted it a turt game, and he said yes... and look what he did.

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/8938/chingfr6.jpg

He is the purple one :D

It's sad to see what he has to do to get stats.

Too bad I didn't have a mod :(
It's sad to see what you have to do to make yourself feel better about lacking any skill whatsoever

[Cuathon]

honestly, rico didnt need to do that to beat you at turts. so im not sure why he did. his set sucks vs. turts anyway.

[philrox]

Yeah, I agree with Cuathon on this. Rico isn't that "good" at turts. He is much better at free anyway... I still don't know why he would say yes to a turt though and then have a free set up.

[Netjak.com~GL~]

dude if u say no dsm then it no dsm no wonder why u got kicked

[Terps rock]

dude if u say no dsm then it no dsm no wonder why u got kicked

Try reading my beautiful story

http://www.tacticsarena.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1019238&postcount=5

[Cuathon]

lol luis, fresh beats me :)

[Luis XVI]

oh well :)