Rock or Rap?

[VAMP7]

This is kinda on a personal note but i wanted to know what a majority of the forum goers listen to.i myself hate yes hate with a fiery passion rap. Why? Well some may already know the true reason but for those who don't lets just leave it open. But my reasons for not likening it are sound. I believe it has turned a generation into a bunch of mindless dribbling idiots with no future goals and nothing to aim for, no jobs and no real reasons besides being considered "cool" for skipping school. I have noticed in my school while i have been there that it gets worse with each generation "freshman - senior" Freshman have just the kind of attitude that gets them nowhere in life and it does not improve much for some even up to the higher levels such as junior and seniors. Now i blame music and the MTV generation is you wish to call it that, Portraying that rebellion is cool disobeying and generally breaking the law is what is cool. It sickens me to see our schools and neighborhoods riddled with such delinquents i cannot even come to call them adults or even young adults because off the level of maturity portrayed by them. Now i ask you do you really act they way you do to be cool or to be yourself. To be the few with a bright future outside the jails and outside the life of drugs and alcohol and to become someone who comes home at night to see the wife and kids and to be thankful for what the lord has given you. Not to take advantage of what has been freely given to you. If i had the power i would make the world over, nay just open the eyes of the people who see crime and drugs and disobedience as a way of life. Not a true American who works a 9-5 shit to come home to wife and kids or even if you don't marry just to come home knowing you are part of those who wish to keep the economy alive. So i ask you each and everyone of you to open your eyes and stop ignoring the people who just leech off us who work and make this world a better place for all. Tell them to get jobs or show them what will happen if they do not get their lives on track. Stop pretending to be someone your not just to impress a bunch of idiots who will probably be in jail before 18. Stop ignoring the fact that it will not happen to you cause it will.

[Tama Drummer]

...To be the few with a bright future outside the jails and outside the life of drugs and alcohol and to become someone who comes home at night to see the wife and kids and to be thankful for what the lord has given you.

Just thought I'd point out (since your thread was closed), MTV/rap doesn't really promote drug/alcohol use, or "rebellion" as you posted. Rather, the whole rock & roll life does. Never heard the saying, "sex, drugs, and rock-n-roll?"

The music itself isn't "ruining" the generation. I may not be a fan of rap, but saying the rap music is ruining a generation is completely retarded.

[ko71991]

I was actually thinking about bringing that thread in here, but I thought I might just get bashed about the whole thing.

But hey, being an underground rap artist, that stuff really tends to piss me off.

[VAMP7]

http://www.fugly.com/media/IMAGES/Nerdy/batman-on-campus.jpg

[Tama Drummer]

But hey, being an underground rap artist, that stuff really tends to piss me off.

Heh, metalheads get it too. We're all "satanic anti-jesus devil worshippers." :p

[ko71991]

http://www.fugly.com/media/IMAGES/Nerdy/batman-on-campus.jpg

And? They say music can alter moods and talk to you, well can it load a gun up for you, and cock it too? Well if it can the next time you can assault a dude, and tell the judge it was a rapper's fault, then they'll get sued. Roughly quoted from Eminem.

[Zander]

and country fans are rednecks...techno fans are potheads/druggys... sublime is the only music agreed upon!

[VAMP7]

Heh, metalheads get it too. We're all "satanic anti-jesus devil worshippers." :p

i acutally like that saying. I just say " hail satan" and then walk off

[VAMP7]

and country fans are rednecks...techno fans are potheads/druggys... sublime is the only music agreed upon!

:dry: not a big fan of your redneck joke there seeing as i am one and i do support the south thus being the reason why i do not like rap:)

[ko71991]

Yeah, but country and techno just gets the usual "country/techno sucks!" if ever the conversation would somehow end up on them.

But rap, or maybe metal, we get the dumbasses that go around "stating their opinions" non-stop, thinking up senseless "reasons" on how rap/metal's supposed to suck, and it's all the music's/music artist's faults.

[Zander]

:dry: not a big fan of your redneck joke there seeing as i am one and i do support the south thus being the reason why i do not like rap:)
I was posting general stereotypes, that is not "my saying"
I've liked music from every genre i've heard.

[VAMP7]

I was posting general stereotypes, that is not "my saying"
I've liked music from every genre i've heard.

who's saying anything about sayings?

[Tama Drummer]

and country fans are rednecks...techno fans are potheads/druggys... sublime is the only music agreed upon!

Haha, well most all people (that I've met, anyway) that listen to country are rednecks/hicks. :D
Of course, where I live, there's rednecks and hicks all over...

[VAMP7]

amen to that =D

[Zander]

my sister listens to country while she's driving.

look like a hick to you?
(she listens to lots of other music as well, for the record)

edited the picture out, no reason to keep it. vamp, you are a moron.

[VAMP7]

look like a hick to you?

yes

[Zander]

Are you trying to be funny or do you honestly believe that?

[VAMP7]

i honestly believe that.:mellow:

[Snork]

MTV/rap doesn't really promote drug/alcohol use, or "rebellion" as you posted. Rather, the whole rock & roll life does. Never heard the saying, "sex, drugs, and rock-n-roll?"


I disagree.

I think the lyrics clearly promote drug/alcohol use, physical and gun violence, and rebellion.

They talk about these things in the song, that clearly influences the people that listen to the music.

To illustrate my point, I'd like to take a few rap songs, the ones vamp accuses of doing this, and breaking down into the words, and analyze the message they bring.
I think that is a fair way to judge, but going to the songs themselves.
Vamp, can you go find some?

As for Rock and Roll promoting drugs, well, the lifestyle many rockers have lived in the public eye justifies your comments on it.

[Snork]

Double post. :(

Tama, do you write your own music?
If so, what is it about?

[xerent]

I submit the following:

- All music influences human behaviour.

- There are examples in every major genre of music which promotes negative and positive behaviour.

- Music stems from human experience.

If the above are accepted, then the following question is proposed.

Is music a cause of bad behaviour, or instead, is it merely reflecting an already existing condition?

[Merdoc.]

Yes.

[Zander]

If it's either of the two, it's the latter.[color="black"]

damn :\ i knew that <_<

[Realist]

Is music a cause of bad behaviour, or instead, is it merely reflecting an already existing condition?

Both, obviously. Any human action is a reflection of an already existing condition, an action can't refelct a condition that doesn't exist and it also can't come from nowhere. And, as you say in your first premise, its pretty clear that music does influence people--sometimes positively and sometimes negatively.

I would add that, while it is true that all major genres have multiple and sometimes conflicting messages within the various artists and songs it contains, it is also true that certain genres of music lend themselves very well to certain feelings and attitudes. It is not a coincidence that most of the major genres of music have their own subcultures with their own distinct attitudes.

And zander, it's two t's. :)

[Zander]

This is kinda on a personal note but i wanted to know what a majority of the forum goers listen to.i myself hate yes hate with a fiery passion rap. Why? Well some may already know the true reason but for those who don't lets just leave it open. But my reasons for not likening it are sound. I believe it has turned a generation into a bunch of mindless dribbling idiots with no future goals and nothing to aim for, no jobs and no real reasons besides being considered "cool" for skipping school. I have noticed in my school while i have been there that it gets worse with each generation "freshman - senior" Freshman have just the kind of attitude that gets them nowhere in life and it does not improve much for some even up to the higher levels such as junior and seniors. Now i blame music and the MTV generation is you wish to call it that, Portraying that rebellion is cool disobeying and generally breaking the law is what is cool. It sickens me to see our schools and neighborhoods riddled with such delinquents i cannot even come to call them adults or even young adults because off the level of maturity portrayed by them. Now i ask you do you really act they way you do to be cool or to be yourself. To be the few with a bright future outside the jails and outside the life of drugs and alcohol and to become someone who comes home at night to see the wife and kids and to be thankful for what the lord has given you. Not to take advantage of what has been freely given to you. If i had the power i would make the world over, nay just open the eyes of the people who see crime and drugs and disobedience as a way of life. Not a true American who works a 9-5 shit to come home to wife and kids or even if you don't marry just to come home knowing you are part of those who wish to keep the economy alive. So i ask you each and everyone of you to open your eyes and stop ignoring the people who just leech off us who work and make this world a better place for all. Tell them to get jobs or show them what will happen if they do not get their lives on track. Stop pretending to be someone your not just to impress a bunch of idiots who will probably be in jail before 18. Stop ignoring the fact that it will not happen to you cause it will.

This turned from rap hatred, to adolescent stereotyping, to christian beliefs, to a cheap poster quote. Realist, I don't know why you reopened this thread, if you thought the debate between rock and rap was a valid one you should've made your own with less of an idiotic opening.

Vamp, you seem to think that everyone who listens to any rap is part of the "i wunna be koo" population, when the percentage of people that listen to rap who participate in this sort of behavior is a lot smaller than you obviously think.

And you're saying that all rap is bad? you talk about christian morals so i'll throw this at you: Do you have any idea how much christian rap music there is? You simply don't like the sound of the music so you say it's all bad.

now, say if you attacked specific things like "g unit" you might have a slightly more valid point, but you didn't, you attacked an entire genre of music and you made yourself look like an idiot in doing so.

edit: heh. while i was typing this realist merged the threads...

[-Dape-]

Rap all the way, how can you listern to a grow man screaming down your tab hole for 4mins and hardly know what he is saying, with rap you know what they're raping about "famliy" "life" "friends" ect...but with rock...what do they rock about....:huh:

[Realist]

I didn't reopen the thread, the person who closed it reopened it and merged the posts.

One other point: Rap is not really a genre of music, any more than, say, a guitar is a genre of music. It's a way of making music. There are multiple genres within rap, perhaps gangsta rap is the one Vamp is referring to. And if rock is a genre of music, it is an extremely broad one.

[Hellblazer]

Rock > Rap, no contest. P Diddy took care of ruining rap and turning it into the bad sex-and-money-based franchise it is today.
However, metal > rock.
And to answer xerent: It reflects a previously existing condition. I got into metal because I needed music to match some of my more sadistical and fantastic thoughts.

[WaCk-HeAd]

Rock > Rap, no contest. P Diddy took care of ruining rap and turning it into the bad sex-and-money-based franchise it is today.

Hahahahahahahahaha

Yeah, stupid P. diddy!! It was him!!

[Tama Drummer]

Double post. :(

Tama, do you write your own music?
If so, what is it about?

Yea, but I don't write lyrics. I just write drum parts. I can show you those if you want. :) Our singer writes all the lyrics, but I don't have them/know what he's saying. I tend not to pay much attention to vocals when I'm playing, so I don't hear what he's saying. He also does the whole metal screaming thing (which I like :D) so even if I did pay attention, I don't know if I'd understand them.

Um, I can remember one chorus line he says though. :)
"Walk with me! For-e-ver!"

[Drain Bamage]

have been there that it gets worse with each generation "freshman - senior" Freshman have just the kind of attitude that gets them nowhere in life

Apathy?

I like "some" rap, same with rock, some of both are crap.

[Matt 34.5]

Oh god, another one of these. This is getting old.

[CRX687]

VAMP... are you sure this attitude is caused by the music? Maybe... idk... it's the lack of proper parenting... or the 'children can do no wrong' education approach... or maybe ALL RAPPERS ARE COMMIES!!!:eek:

rap: good when you're in a car trying to stay a wake, or when you're with a hot chick on a dance floor
rock: good for backgroud music while multitasking

but kareyoke/ddr music pwns all when it comes to the destruction of general boredom.

[bludhoundz]

but kareyoke/ddr music pwns all when it comes to the destruction of general boredom.

Ah, I love the hilarity of stereotypes.

For those of you who are not on the inside of this joke.. well, you're missing out :p

[Drain Bamage]

There are so many different kinds of rock to listen to.

I guess I'll just shuffle :E

NO WHAMMIES, NO WHAMMIES.

[The Ultimater]

umm...dude, Vamp there was a thread just like this last year, and yeah I vote for rock! :cool2:

[Woodland]

This isn't fair. =(

I listen too Eminem, 50 cent etc on some occasions.

Then on the other hand, I listen too Guns 'N' Roses, Linkin Park and Lostprophets.

Thanks for making my life complicated for 10 whole minutes.

[Wizzy`]

Heh, metalheads get it too. We're all "satanic anti-jesus devil worshippers." :p
Yeah. It gets rather annoying. :\


and country fans are rednecks...techno fans are potheads/druggys... sublime is the only music agreed upon!
Usually techno is for druggies and potheads and country for rednecks, it's a stereotype, because it's true...not entirley, but true.

:dry: not a big fan of your redneck joke there seeing as i am one and i do support the south thus being the reason why i do not like rap:)

Are you saying you're racist?

[Worker]

Yeah. It gets rather annoying. :\



Usually techno is for druggies and potheads and country for rednecks, it's a stereotype, because it's true...not entirley, but true.

Though you are correct to some extent, the people whom are to blame for that "druggie" stereotype have no concern for the actual music, leading to this negative stereotype upon those who enjoy to produce, play, and listen to that genre. Most sub-cultures that go along with a genre have a drug aspect that is negative. Its just been more obvious and blatent in the past with the 'raves' of electronic music(techno), making it an easy target for the negative views.

[WaCk-HeAd]

You like techno, worker?

Please tell me it isn't so.

I don't dislike any music except for trance / techno / hardhouse / hardcore etc.

[CRX687]

Ah, I love the hilarity of stereotypes.

For those of you who are not on the inside of this joke.. well, you're missing out :p

stereotypes rock. I love being a minority cuz when things don't go your way, you can just whop out the box of stereotypes and everything's all better:cool:

It's like a reusable get out of jail free card in real life.

[Wizzy`]

Though you are correct to some extent, the people whom are to blame for that "druggie" stereotype have no concern for the actual music, leading to this negative stereotype upon those who enjoy to produce, play, and listen to that genre. Most sub-cultures that go along with a genre have a drug aspect that is negative. Its just been more obvious and blatent in the past with the 'raves' of electronic music(techno), making it an easy target for the negative views.

im not saying anything bad about techno, cause i love it.
but usually druggies listen to it, cause it gives them SUCH freakin' good trip expierence.(sp?)

[Teacher]

When I was younger I used to stereotype and assume that rap was nothing but shit. This was before I actually paid attention to the words of a song. I can honestly say that I listen to a little bit of every genre. I will also say that there are songs in every genre of music that I dislike either for the lyrics or the music itself, and occasionally the voice of the singer.

All of my friends when I was a teenager listened to rap so I got used to some of that. My little brother listens to Eminem (sp?) I listen to him, just because most of his songs are funny as hell. I listen to country because I sing, and I can understand what they are saying. (No I don't wear a cowboy hat and boots... well maybe boots)

As for saying that any particular type of music is to blame for the downfall of society is assinine. That ranks up there with the dumbasses that say kids do things because they seen them done on a video game. People that allow music or video games for that matter depict their own behavior apparently have some reality problems.

As for music playing a roll in a person's emotional state, it is very possible. There are songs that can make me happy, and there are certain songs that I listen too when I'm pissed off. Just depends on the mood that I am in at the time.

(Just heard a Michael Jackson song on XM radio, I suddenly have this urge to invite a bunch of boys over for a sleep over so they can play with my pet monkey...Bubbles)

[Lightning lion]

well rock is good on long ride while rap is fun to listen to with friends so ill say rap if it has a good beat

[Chaos 4.0]

I just love rock. I think it rules. Just my opinion though, I kinda don't like rap, I don't know why but I just don't like it.

[VAMP7]

When I was younger I used to stereotype and assume that rap was nothing but shit. This was before I actually paid attention to the words of a song. I can honestly say that I listen to a little bit of every genre. I will also say that there are songs in every genre of music that I dislike either for the lyrics or the music itself, and occasionally the voice of the singer.

All of my friends when I was a teenager listened to rap so I got used to some of that. My little brother listens to Eminem (sp?) I listen to him, just because most of his songs are funny as hell. I listen to country because I sing, and I can understand what they are saying. (No I don't wear a cowboy hat and boots... well maybe boots)

As for saying that any particular type of music is to blame for the downfall of society is assinine. That ranks up there with the dumbasses that say kids do things because they seen them done on a video game. People that allow music or video games for that matter depict their own behavior apparently have some reality problems.

As for music playing a roll in a person's emotional state, it is very possible. There are songs that can make me happy, and there are certain songs that I listen too when I'm pissed off. Just depends on the mood that I am in at the time.

(Just heard a Michael Jackson song on XM radio, I suddenly have this urge to invite a bunch of boys over for a sleep over so they can play with my pet monkey...Bubbles)


Well i guess most of this stems from when i used to listen to some rap at around age 9 or 10 when i asked someone who is very dear to me almost i like to think of him as my soul. Anyways i asked him to listen to some rap and he said rap is gay and so i guess i switched to it there and got into metal hardcore. And they say that metal is just screaming? Well rap is just a bunch of people banging on random crap to make a beat and someone to just say things that sound good to certain people. I would also like to add that it really makes me mad that about 60% of my gym class is those "wiggers" White people that try so hard to act black that it is pathetic. I am on probation so i guess that is the only thing that is keeping me from putting there head through a cement wall when they put rap on the loudspeakers in the gym. In short i guess that this is a very broad topic that really can't be solved without some conflict.

[Worker]

You like techno, worker?

Please tell me it isn't so.

I don't dislike any music except for trance / techno / hardhouse / hardcore etc.I spin mostly hard trance, though I do have a place in my heart for hard house and some DnB/Jungle. Breakbeats are where its at though, and what id produce if I had the equipment. Though compared to a lot of genre's of music, there is a lot more crap than quality in electronica and I dislike a vast majority of it...so I understand your feelings ;)

im not saying anything bad about techno, cause i love it.
but usually druggies listen to it, cause it gives them SUCH freakin' good trip expierence.(sp?)I do not disagree with you, just elaborating. The bad quality is what people see it for, its well deserved and its near impossible to see past that


The debates about music will never end, music progresses and genre's have influence on each other. Most of the examples used to put down a particular style are bad examples, poor quality, and not something that should be used to generalize the whole. It seems some of the negative views have little to do with the music itself, but that persons experience with, and feelings toward the people that follow it.

[VAMP7]

http://www.fugly.com/media/IMAGES/Funny/Rapper_Costume.jpg

[Merdoc.]

Paragraphs please.

Rap FTW.

[jedi knight]

rap, but if its has a good beat.however if the rock is good,its tied

[Wizzy`]

I have recently left all rock/heavy metal behind.

I am all about rap now.
Well, I shouldn't say ALL about rap..But I like it more.
I do not know what changed my mind about the subject, I just find rap more appealing.

Now..to break it to my brother. >_<

[Jimmy]

well i like both, but i'd have to say i like rock better :cool:.

[Elentari]

http://www.toothpastefordinner.com/102806/country-or-rap.gif

TPFD ftw!

I don't promote musicism. What matters is whether or not the song is good/appeals to you.

Rock and metal are what I listen to most often.

[WaCk-HeAd]

Anthony Hamilton FTW!