Anti-Rushes, over-used?

[Hydro Cloron]

I think the amount of Anti's these days is absurd. They are the most un-original sets imaginable and very easy to beat.

That's my opinion.

Thanks,
Hydro Cloron

[Learz]

I like to play with the default formation (which I call teh "basic" formation).

I *almost* beat a 1265 gold the other day with a basic. He had a standered anti.

By *almost*, I mean he had a half health scout and a full health drag left. He had started with 3 knights, drag, mud, 2 scouts, frost, and cleric.

Are they easy to beat? Mmm... maybe. I think it depends on teh player.
Are they overused? Most definitely.

[Hatchet Warrior]

Anti's are easier to beat these days if you are using the correct units or placement of units.
They are over used, so make a set that blows them outta the water until they starting rushing against you.

[FreddyAdu23]

i agree the set is way over used

depends on who ur vsing

[imagination]

The funny thing is very few people actually know how to use an anti correctly. When you find a player that uses an anti the way it is supposed to they are extremely hard to beat but i agree they are overused because poeple who dont know how to make a form that suits them just use an anti because they see everyone else doing that.

[steve12]

Yeah, too many people use them; and they don't use original variations either. I quit Anti-ing all the time a few months ago; I find using formations like that pretty boring, and I don't like the fact that it isn't as versatile as spreads and/or rushes. Also, most Anti-Rush vs. Anti-Rush games tend to be played out in the same manner, though it depends on the player. Very few players can use an Anti-Rush well, and like imag said, they are very tough opponents.

[FreddyAdu23]

when i play the anti, i want u to take my cleric...
i just try and make it cost u to much (like make it so once uve killed my cleric u cant win cause ur out of units)

[steve12]

As long as you have your Frost Golem left, and the person rushing in has lost a lot of his range/power, you can win pretty comfortably without your Cleric.

[FreddyAdu23]

exactly what i want to happen

[TeXaS LoNgHoRnS]

The funny thing is very few people actually know how to use an anti correctly. When you find a player that uses an anti the way it is supposed to they are extremely hard to beat

thats exactly the way i feel...

Hydro is saying that htye are easy to beat cause maybe he hasnt played a good anti, or played a person with anti-skills.

If you think that they are really easy to beat, try playing DFP's anti, then tqalk to me

[Anarchy_United]

They are way, way overused.

[bobo99]

Overused, I don't think anyone could possibly argue agains't this.
Easy to beat, depends on the player.

[TeXaS LoNgHoRnS]

A_U is way, way overused

[|AFO|]

Yeah, too many people use them; and they don't use original variations either. I quit Anti-ing all the time a few months ago; I find using formations like that pretty boring, and I don't like the fact that it isn't as versatile as spreads and/or rushes. Also, most Anti-Rush vs. Anti-Rush games tend to be played out in the same manner, though it depends on the player. Very few players can use an Anti-Rush well, and like imag said, they are very tough opponents.

Most of this I agree with, but saying that the anti isn't as versatile as a spread or a rush I do not agree with. The anti has the ability to beat every other set out there. It has no large disadvantage. Even an opp. side turtle will have a tough time against a good anti user. Its not easy stopping three knights, two scouts, a mud, and a dragon.

Anyway...I'm starting to see the anti die down a little bit. Haven't played too many of the cliched in the free try outs.

[Faulty Logic]

I like to play with the default formation (which I call teh "basic" formation).

I *almost* beat a 1265 gold the other day with a basic. He had a standered anti.

By *almost*, I mean he had a half health scout and a full health drag left. He had started with 3 knights, drag, mud, 2 scouts, frost, and cleric.

Are they easy to beat? Mmm... maybe. I think it depends on teh player.
Are they overused? Most definitely.



actually, the basic form is teh "n()()b form" and I pwn at it.... actually how I ogt a name for myself within SI back in the old days...
:rolleyes::rolleyes:

"n()()b" grey accounts are far more versatile when facing a standard anti rush. The grey has 9 mobile pieces b/c he doesnt have an l ward or a b ward, and in my opinion, against other golds, a chanty is far more effective than a frosty, you should check out nads site, or my strat link to see why... but thats my personal opinion...

now as to the question...
I don't play much at all anymore, but what Iahve to askis why does it matter? what was the point of this, I beleive this is called "general strateg" not complain about what you don't like. I'm sorry if you're taking this harshly, but seriously thinkabout hwat you're saying....

if point is tried and true and it gets boring it doesnt mean it is wrong... there is a purpose to "tradition". as to if players can play a good anti-well...well thats another problem all together.

antis are good for newer golds in my opinion b/c it is so similar to a grey account b/c it utilizes the same basic strategy of a corner or center turt... why fix it if it aint broken... now if its so easy for you, then why not try and challenge your slef by changing YOUR gameplay instead of having everyone lese shift their style to fit your need.

my 2 cents...

--FL

[phoenixofflames]

Anti's are overused.

Especially Bobcat's anti.

But if people like it, that's fine, they should use it.

[steve12]

Phoe, why don't we teach all of the new people just to use the Anti-Killer? That'll change the flow.

[imagination]

anti killers suck when they arent playing an anti ... if you are going to use a form use a solid rush that can win no matter what it plays.

[steve12]

anti killers suck when they arent playing an anti ... if you are going to use a form use a solid rush that can win no matter what it plays.

My point exactly. Again, I like spreads/central rushes which aren't clumped together because they are versatile.

[LosPollos]

I use an anti when i freestyle, it's part of my rotation. I don't shun in just because it's popular.

[FiReBrAnD]

Screw 'em all! Turt is where it is at.

[xFalconx]

http://img387.imageshack.us/img387/2738/crapantimz5.png

Since this is an anti-rush thread, I was hoping to get some feedback on what this set (the standard anti) can do if a beast takes the first turn to run up 4, and get past the end knight.

[LosPollos]

http://img387.imageshack.us/img387/2738/crapantimz5.png

Since this is an anti-rush thread, I was hoping to get some feedback on what this set (the standard anti) can do if a beast takes the first turn to run up 4, and get past the end knight.

Not much unless you get lucky with positioning. Such as no ambusher or muddie same-side.

[Hatchet Warrior]

I got two sets that easily render that one useless after a few turns.

[xFalconx]

Yeah, thats one big flaw (In addition to it's already big flaw in playing opp corner turts) as over the past day I'v played two anti-rushes same-sided with a beast on their end. It wasnt pretty.

[imagination]

in my oppinion that is the "best" anti out there today as far as anti's go.

[|AFO|]

A good anti user would make you give up that BR as well as another ranged unit. Then go for either the other range or the cleric depending on your unit placement. Now...what if you're BR can't flank? He's basically an easy kill..

And if it was a same side game against a good anti user you wouldn't keep your cleric alive for very long either..plus you would have had to give up your BR and another ranged unit for their cleric.

I don't see why you all think that the anti has a huge disadvantage against an opp. turtle. If you trade mobile attackers you'll win (especially if they are using a wisp or furgon)..With two scouts it shouldn't be hard to put pressure on them anyway.

The reason that the anti has become so popular is because it doesn't have any huge disadvantages..

[Flark]

I see a lot more centered rushes these days actually. There are many people with anti set-ups, but more commonly I see the standard GA, mud rushes, usually associated with killing the cleric rather than defending it. Such as an anti does.

[cheese steak]

I see alot of anti's, along with alot of crappy rushes. :dry:

[Magician]

Antis are almost, dare I say it, cliched.

Firebrand is right:
Screw 'em all! Turt is where it is at.
QFT.

[Hatchet Warrior]

A good anti user would make you give up that BR as well as another ranged unit. Then go for either the other range or the cleric depending on your unit placement. Now...what if you're BR can't flank? He's basically an easy kill..

And if it was a same side game against a good anti user you wouldn't keep your cleric alive for very long either..plus you would have had to give up your BR and another ranged unit for their cleric.

I don't see why you all think that the anti has a huge disadvantage against an opp. turtle. If you trade mobile attackers you'll win (especially if they are using a wisp or furgon)..With two scouts it shouldn't be hard to put pressure on them anyway.

The reason that the anti has become so popular is because it doesn't have any huge disadvantages..

I can kill a cleric and either lose one unit not being my BR, or none usually.
Furg turt with drag pwns opp anti.

I see a lot more centered rushes these days actually. There are many people with anti set-ups, but more commonly I see the standard GA, mud rushes, usually associated with killing the cleric rather than defending it. Such as an anti does.

GA rush's are good if same side. It's usually harder with a center rush ga to kill the cleric unless you use it correctly.

[bludhoundz]

The funny thing is very few people actually know how to use an anti correctly. When you find a player that uses an anti the way it is supposed to they are extremely hard to beat but i agree they are overused because poeple who dont know how to make a form that suits them just use an anti because they see everyone else doing that.
Yep.

Only a few people use an anti well, like ED.

A good anti user would make you give up that BR as well as another ranged unit. Then go for either the other range or the cleric depending on your unit placement. Now...what if you're BR can't flank? He's basically an easy kill..

And if it was a same side game against a good anti user you wouldn't keep your cleric alive for very long either..plus you would have had to give up your BR and another ranged unit for their cleric.

I don't see why you all think that the anti has a huge disadvantage against an opp. turtle. If you trade mobile attackers you'll win (especially if they are using a wisp or furgon)..With two scouts it shouldn't be hard to put pressure on them anyway.

The reason that the anti has become so popular is because it doesn't have any huge disadvantages..

You're right about the anti vs rush thing - a good anti will take the range ASAP in return for the cleric, then frostwhore.

The reason I think the anti is fundamentally flawed is because of the huge difference in dealing with the huge asymmetry.

A good opposite turtle can quash any early attempts at attacking against a strong anti, and then control the board easily.

[l2oving Elve]

Okay, it doesn't even matter if it is overused. That is the player's choice. Anti-Rushes may suck but still! It does depend on the player & units sometimes. Say if you had the weakest possible units in it, duh its gonna suck a bit but it all depends on the player.

[bludhoundz]

Okay, it doesn't even matter if it is overused. That is the player's choice. Anti-Rushes may suck but still! It does depend on the player & units sometimes. Say if you had the weakest possible units in it, duh its gonna suck a bit but it all depends on the player.

Nobody is saying that an anti is a bad form. It's definitely very strong in most situations, which is why it's become so popular.

[|AFO|]

Hmm..I've beaten countless opp. side turtles with armored dragons using the anti. All you have to do is lure the dragon out of their base and attack the other flank quickly taking out the frost/cleric and de-focusing the stone. Its much harder to do on legends with one scout.

But also..the anti has three knights. If they use all of them in the attack the turtle will have a hard time holding them back.

And HW...if you can lose no units while killing the cleric of a good anti user then you must be TAO God. =P