Lifecrystal

[johannhowitzer]

Can you tell I really want to see this type of unit incorporated into the game?

This is a modified version of the Doppelganger concept I came up with a year or so ago. The idea of a shapeshifting unit is not a stranger to this forum, certainly, but even then I came up with some unique balancing mechanics. The unit was still mildly overpowered for grey forms thanks to the barrier ward and copying enemy dragons, and underpowered in gold forms due to low survivability. This new version hopefully compensates for both. Comments are very welcomed.

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LIFECRYSTAL

HP: 45
Power: Shapeshift
Armor: 0
Blocking: 100% All sides
Recovery: 1
Movement: Immobile
Range: 3

Shapeshift
Changes into the target enemy unit, taking on that unit's attributes - Power, Armor, Blocking, Recovery, Movement, and Range and attack pattern are copied, but the Lifecrystal's Hit Points are never affected. No special abilities such as Mudquake may be copied. Friendly units and immobile enemy units may not be copied.

Additional Information
Only steps aside for friendly units to pass when copying a unit that can do so.

Solidify
Restores the Lifecrystal's natural attributes, once again becoming immobile and resting for 2 turns. This ability is activated in the same manner as Mudquake.

While affected by a Focus spell, the Lifecrystal may not change form or use Solidify. However, if shifted, it may attack in the manner of the copied unit.

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Changes made since the previous version, with the reasoning for each:

HP increased to 45, to allow it to stand a fighting chance in gold forms. Will survive two knight attacks without a heal, but not a third even with heal; will survive two witch attacks with a heal, but barely. In shifted form, reflects a weakened/strengthened version of the unit in question - a weaker Knight or Dragon, but boosted Witch or Cleric (if you can get that far into your opponent's form, you DESERVE to have an extra high-hp cleric in serious danger!)

This is essentially a Ward; while unshifted, blocking is 100% all sides, instead of 40% like a dragon, but it's immobile. This has the effect of making it a deterrent rather than an active threat, but a somewhat mobile one. You may never get that chance to shift into a Dragon Tyrant, if your opponent doesn't give it to you. The 2-turn cooldown after unshifting helps this, giving the enemy a chance to move powerful units out of range.

The duplication of all units should be pretty intuitive; while in the previous topic I had a detailed list of units which could be duplicated, forbidding both wards and the Dragon Tyrant, this version forbids only both Wards, and does not block friendly units' special abilities. Again, I wasn't too concerned with the inclusion of the Dragon thanks to immobility, but duplicating wards in enemy territory is too powerful - especially with a normal barrier ward to help create a dire latent threat.


I do not believe this unit to be overpowered, but others may disagree. The immobility factor makes it less of a power, and combined with cooldown after unshifting, you can't just shift like crazy. On top of that, when unshifting, you must decide on a good location to "plant" the Lifecrystal! This allows creation of a non-melee "wall," but one which can't be moved and re-moved rapidly. I'm thinking of disallowing the Solidify ability if the unit has moved already, as "jumping" a ward into place using Poison Wisp movement could be too powerful. Remember, though, to move again, you require enemy units nearby! This means "planting" in one's own territory must be done carefully, to avoid either becoming a movement hindrance or sinking into uselessness.

This unit specializes in creating all sorts of latent threats, like the Lightning Ward and Dragon Tyrant. It must, however, remain vulnerable in order to work to full effect; unlike either of its cousin Wards, it cannot do anything unless shifted while under the protection of a barrier or armored by a Stone Golem! This prevents the addition of Hit Points from making it overpowered in grey forms.

[josh 4]

It's okay, i like the idea...but isn't this thing a bit too complicated for the game? Keep those ideas coming, though, overall good job ;).

[Maniacuser]

No way, i think its a really good unit, very balnced, not over or underpowered, out of all the units i've seen, this is one of my faves. Good job.

[The Coder]

lulz, epik phail. Just what we need, 45 health clerics, 45 health DSMs, not just that, but 2 DSMs!

[josh 4]

2 dragons! (although one would admitedly have lower health)

[†Tao Veteran†]

lulz, epik phail. Just what we need, 45 health clerics, 45 health DSMs, not just that, but 2 DSMs!

I haven't disagreed with you in a long ass time, Coder but apparently you didn't think it through that much.

For one thing, if it shifted into another dsm, it would only "technically" be an additional pyromancer. And in order for it to work like a normal dsm is if you had a DT on board, in which most cases would have a DT on board but I'm sure the would make a ban of the dsm having no special powers while you have another dsm on board.

Just like they made that rule for Muddy's.

I like the idea but chances of this unit being implimented are very slim. Very slim.

[johannhowitzer]

It's okay, i like the idea...but isn't this thing a bit too complicated for the game? Keep those ideas coming, though, overall good job ;).
This was one of my concerns about the unit, actually. All other units are quite simple, even the DSM or Furgon. Here's the thing - while it may seem complicated in presentation, I think the unit as a whole can be boiled down to a few basic points:

1) Can copy enemy units, but not their special attacks.
2) Can't shift or unshift while being affected by focus.
3) Can't copy wards.
4) Unshifted form acts exactly like a Ward - can't move, 100% blocking.

You've got a ward that can copy anything but a ward unless a spell is on it. That's it. It just took a lot longer to explain in the format I gave above, but I had to be exact there. The actual amount of information I gave above, in fact, in the unit description, is no larger than any other unit, it just seems like it at first! Even the stepping aside is self-explanatory - it acts like a ward when not shifted, otherwise like the unit it copies.

lulz, epik phail. Just what we need, 45 health clerics, 45 health DSMs, not just that, but 2 DSMs!
Yep, but 45 health clerics that are within three spaces of the enemy cleric... in other words, dooooooomed. Second DSM should act just like a pyromancer, as was said (not to mention your opponent has to have a DSM and put it in range of this thing for you to get one...). Also, don't forget one very important thing - you have to USE a turn to shapeshift!! That's critical time spent.

No way, i think its a really good unit, very balnced, not over or underpowered, out of all the units i've seen, this is one of my faves. Good job.
That means a heck of a lot, thank you. I've been refining my concept of this unit for a long, long time, this isn't a one-day hack job.

like the idea but chances of this unit being implimented are very slim. Very slim.
Isn't that true of all presented units? When was the last time a new unit was introduced, let alone on the suggestion of a forum member? I know it's been at least a year, I've been around that long and maybe longer.

Thanks for all the critique. I've been thinking a little more, too, about this bit:
I'm thinking of disallowing the Solidify ability if the unit has moved already, as "jumping" a ward into place using Poison Wisp movement could be too powerful.
This might not be necessary. It severely jeopardizes the Lifecrystal! If you unshift deep in enemy territory, you must remain immobile for 2 turns, and you must be unprotected for a turn in order to escape, since you can't shift from behind a barrier. In other words, a desperate move, so I see no reason to forbid move-unshift at this time. Risk must still be weighed against reward - both in this case can be extreme. You'd even have to "use" an enemy unit's movement to get out of there, which introduces countermeasures all its own...

45 Hit Points might seem like a lot when talking about a usually fragile unit, guys, but remember, you're expending a turn to shift and your opponent has to put a unit within reach of the Lifecrystal before you can duplicate it. In other words, if your opponent doesn't want you to duplicate his dragon, you'll have a hard time doing so... at least once he learns the strategy behind it. Also, in gold turtles etc., use of the Stone Golem is pretty handicapped. If you armor the unshifted form, it can't DO anything except be an obstacle, and if you armor the shifted form, you're stuck with that form. If you have lots of armored units away from the Stone Golem, this means to un-armor the shifted Lifecrystal you have to un-armor THEM too. And un-armoring to unshift costs yet another turn to pull off. This effectively means that armoring this unit is awkward and probably inadvisable most times, dropping its "true HP" in games where Stone Golems are present.

Maybe we could try this unit on a probationary basis? Please? I know I'm asking a lot, but many people have suggested shapeshifting units in the past, so the public seems to want one to mess around with. :)

[The Coder]

This was one of my concerns about the unit, actually. All other units are quite simple, even the DSM or Furgon. Here's the thing - while it may seem complicated in presentation, I think the unit as a whole can be boiled down to a few basic points:

1) Can copy enemy units, but not their special attacks.
2) Can't shift or unshift while being affected by focus.
3) Can't copy wards.
4) Unshifted form acts exactly like a Ward - can't move, 100% blocking.

You've got a ward that can copy anything but a ward unless a spell is on it. That's it. It just took a lot longer to explain in the format I gave above, but I had to be exact there. The actual amount of information I gave above, in fact, in the unit description, is no larger than any other unit, it just seems like it at first! Even the stepping aside is self-explanatory - it acts like a ward when not shifted, otherwise like the unit it copies.


Yep, but 45 health clerics that are within three spaces of the enemy cleric... in other words, dooooooomed. Second DSM should act just like a pyromancer, as was said. Also, don't forget one very important thing - you have to USE a turn to shapeshift!! That's critical time spent.


That means a heck of a lot, thank you. I've been refining my concept of this unit for a long, long time, this isn't a one-day hack job.


Isn't that true of all presented units? When was the last time a new unit was introduced, let alone on the suggestion of a forum member? I know it's been at least a year, I've been around that long and maybe longer.

Thanks for all the critique. I've been thinking a little more, too, about this bit:

This might not be necessary. It severely jeopardizes the Lifecrystal! If you unshift deep in enemy territory, you must remain immobile for 2 turns, and you must be unprotected for a turn in order to escape, since you can't shift from behind a barrier. In other words, a desperate move, so I see no reason to forbid move-unshift at this time. Risk must still be weighed against reward - both in this case can be extreme. You'd even have to "use" an enemy unit's movement to get out of there, which introduces countermeasures all its own...

45 Hit Points might seem like a lot when talking about a usually fragile unit, guys, but remember, you're expending a turn to shift and your opponent has to put a unit within reach of the Lifecrystal before you can duplicate it. In other words, if your opponent doesn't want you to duplicate his dragon, you'll have a hard time doing so... at least once he learns the strategy behind it. Also, in gold turtles etc., use of the Stone Golem is pretty handicapped. If you armor the unshifted form, it can't DO anything except be an obstacle, and if you armor the shifted form, you're stuck with that form. If you have lots of armored units away from the Stone Golem, this means to un-armor the shifted Lifecrystal you have to un-armor THEM too. And un-armoring to unshift costs yet another turn to pull off. This effectively means that armoring this unit is awkward and probably inadvisable most times, dropping its "true HP" in games where Stone Golems are present.

Maybe we could try this unit on a probationary basis? Please? I know I'm asking a lot, but many people have suggested shapeshifting units in the past, so the public seems to want one to mess around with. :)

Shorten the blocks maybe?

[johannhowitzer]

What blocks? Blocks of text? You didn't complain about my first post. And so far you haven't tried to offer anything constructive, only destructive.

[farcus]

overpowered and too complicated for this game

[johannhowitzer]

That is easily said. Would you mind explaining, so it isn't just a flat-out rejection?

Be constructive, people. That's all I ask.

[johannhowitzer]

Bumping this. People seem to be choosing to trash mark14's posts a lot... I'm sure negativity is fun and all, but can't we be positive for a little bit?

[Boreal]

Hmm...so confusing! Unfortunately, there is no easy way to explain how this thing works, but I think I get the gist of it. It seems to have a lot of strategic potential, especially because it can become any enemy unit and then tank if it needs a heal. However, you put the wait time to 2 turns if you unshift. I would personally set the wait time after unshifting equal to the wait time of the unit that it just unshifted from. That way, it is more balanced should you decide to copy a powerhouse DT or a weaker knight. That's all I have for now, I can't really find anything else wrong with it. You're 2-0 so far. =P

[johannhowitzer]

The Lifecrystal and Warlock are recent units, my other three were made almost a year ago. I wouldn't even look at the Doppelganger, since the Lifecrystal is a much improved version of the same idea.

Even if this unit seems confusing, there are similarly complicated units in TAO already - they just don't seem confusing because we're accustomed to them. Give a player a day or two to try this thing out and he'd have it down cold.

Not sure I understand your case for wait time after Solidify... the idea is that if you unshift, you're going to need to stick in that spot for a little while to recharge. And would it be the full wait time or the attacking two-thirds?